Why dream act and not legal immigration?

[willigetgc?]

http://org2.democracyinaction.org/dia/track.jsp?v=2&c=WgK4b2ZzK3h0uTDFXmnZmWaX%2FV8A2kOY
If the Dream Act passes, credit must go to those who have fought for it most strenuously, at greater personal risk and inconvenience than anyone else: the young people whose futures it will decide. Thousands of students, calling themselves “undocumented and unafraid,” have led an admirable campaign of advocacy under the threat of arrest and deportation.

They have marched hundreds of miles, fasted for days, staged sit-ins and held bittersweet mock graduations. In letters and phone calls, on Twitter and Facebook, the Dream activists have told their stories to whoever will listen, firmly confronting those who won’t.

Gaby Pacheco once hugged Joe Arpaio, a sheriff in Arizona, momentarily disarming his anti-immigrant virulence. Recently, she and five others were in the office of Senator John McCain, a former Dream Act co-sponsor, urging him to summon the courage he now disowns. She reminded him of his promise in 2007 to fight for the bill. He begged off. She persisted: What about your promise? What about my family?

Either our legal immigrant community is not as desperate as the illegal community or we want others to do the job and expect the results.........
Do not give me reds for stating a fact.

[Hello_Hello]

what you are saying is true...look at India and then compare it with Mexico. We did not come here to do what is written here that illegals are doing. We do not deserve to do all this nonsense. If I don't get green card my foot...my country is there...unlike the illegals who have a torn state back home...Also the lawmakers here know that it is a serious problem that we are facing but they will only resolve it when they feel there is positive environment in the country prevailing to pass a legal legislation. Phone calls, letters are not going to change their course of action.
Either our legal immigrant community is not as desperate as the illegal community or we want others to do the job and expect the results.........
Do not give me reds for stating a fact.

[satyasrd]

It's a matter of unity. The hispanic community is much more united and they fight together. Heck, they even love their language so much !

Honestly, that is what is lacking with the legals. Between USC's, permanent residents, EAD holders etc etc this community is falling apart.

And, I absolutely agree that writing letters or even meeting with senators will not help. We need to think of something massive.... I suggest a rally in DC. I am willing to contribute for this effort.

[abhishek101]

It is called Vote Bank,

Hispanics are like 7-10% of population. They decide polls in Big states like CA, TX, AZ. Once we have these kind of numbers we can also get this kind of attention.

The biggest point whenever anybody talks aagainst Illegal immigration is how hispanics will punish them in elections. That is why political pundits say that republicans will decline in the long run. I have never heard this for any other group even Chinese.

It is all about Vote Bank

[hello]

satyasrd.I am with you we should plan some big rally so we can be heard and will contribute to that.sitting and waiting won't do any good.

[go_guy123]

It is called Vote Bank,

Hispanics are like 7-10% of population. They decide polls in Big states like CA, TX, AZ. Once we have these kind of numbers we can also get this kind of attention.

The biggest point whenever anybody talks aagainst Illegal immigration is how hispanics will punish them in elections. That is why political pundits say that republicans will decline in the long run. I have never heard this for any other group even Chinese.

It is all about Vote Bank

Rightfully said....abhishek101. In fact the sheer numbers all Hispcanic candidates like gutirrez to rely on vote banks in high immigrant states. So they in return push dream act or comprehensive immi reform in the past. On the other hand Bobby Jindal et al cant rely on Indian/Asian vote bank and have to run on "high conservative" items to be accepted and elected.

[willigetgc?]

It is called Vote Bank,

Hispanics are like 7-10% of population. They decide polls in Big states like CA, TX, AZ. Once we have these kind of numbers we can also get this kind of attention.

The biggest point whenever anybody talks aagainst Illegal immigration is how hispanics will punish them in elections. That is why political pundits say that republicans will decline in the long run. I have never heard this for any other group even Chinese.

It is all about Vote Bank

Yes it is all about vote bank. That is exactly how you and I would react if we were in the lawmakers shoes.......... Our biggest concern is immigration, and yet we are the most un-united group. Think about it - Who are the ones who will punish the lawmakers during elections - the illegals or the hispanic citizens? There lies your answer - our own community deserts us! One day, when we get our green cards, we won't campaign for the ones less fortunate..........well, we are effected now, and 90% of the members in this organization has never met with the lawmaker even once...........

Hispanics/illegals have the strength of population, they donate well, they stand united and work for each others betterment. Right now, they don't even fear deportation! while we legal immigrants are afraid to give out names to organizations such as IV......

satyasrd.I am with you we should plan some big rally so we can be heard and will contribute to that.sitting and waiting won't do any good.

One big rally does no good, there has to be many rallies all across the US and this has to happen frequently. One time of anything is just a drop of water in the ocean - it makes no difference.

These are facts and unless we act as a united group - persistently contact our lawmakers and make them see our perspective, otherwise it will just be "wait" and "complain - nothing is happening"

[sanprabhu]

No we do not need to hold rallies or go to senators. What we need to do is make the link between the recapture and the border security. That means paying extra for each of these GC from the recapture like 1500.

I think it would mean billions for the border security and the politicians love that.

Sandeep

[tonyHK12]

What we need to do is make the link between the recapture and the border security. That means paying extra for each of these GC from the recapture like 1500.

I think it would mean billions for the border security and the politicians love that.

Sandeep

Yes this is a good idea. As I had said before many of us have contributed dollars 30,000 to 50,000 in social security and if we leave before 10 years we are going to lose everything.
Its a win-win for both.

Besides most Legal immigrants are naturally highly motivated in protecting the border.

[willigetgc?]

No we do not need to hold rallies or go to senators. What we need to do is make the link between the recapture and the border security. That means paying extra for each of these GC from the recapture like 1500.

I think it would mean billions for the border security and the politicians love that.

Sandeep

You said it.. that is right $1500 for each GC and divert this fund to Border building and make the EB dates current. Way to GO! This is a great idea. IV should think about it and come out with a document to make the senators aware.

Yes this is a good idea. As I had said before many of us have contributed dollars 30,000 to 50,000 in social security and if we leave before 10 years we are going to lose everything.
Its a win-win for both.

Let me see if I understand this - you are proposing $1500 for green cards and this would apply to all (employment, family, asylum, lottery based) right?
If not - this idea/dream can end right now.
If yes - it will be a nightmare scenario for dhs - no politician will touch it - latinos will be handing out $1500 at the POE and claiming GCs and so will the terrorists............

Ideas are good but fantasies never help.

[tonyHK12]

Let me see if I understand this - you are proposing $1500 for green cards and this would apply to all (employment, family, asylum, lottery based) right?
If not - this idea/dream can end right now.
If yes - it will be a nightmare scenario for dhs - no politician will touch it - latinos will be handing out $1500 at the POE and claiming GCs and so will the terrorists............

Ideas are good but fantasies never help.

Nope, the 1500 is not to buy a Green Card. It is the extra fees for finalizing petitions by re-capture or extra visas in a short time - like 1 year, for those who have already qualified like EB2 and EB3 queue. Currently there are about 500,000 in the EB queue at different stages.
They still have to qualify first and clear EB2, EB3, asylum requirements, not just pay money.
Actually since we anyway pay 1000 for premium processing, maybe the fee should be a bit higher for an additional visa itself.

7.5 Billion from just EBs....
If we add qualifying family based - very serious money

[willigetgc?]

Nope, the 1500 is not to buy a Green Card. It is the extra fees for finalizing petitions by re-capture or extra visas in a short time - like 1 year, for those who have already qualified like EB2 and EB3 queue. Currently there are about 500,000 in the EB queue at different stages.
They still have to qualify first and clear EB2, EB3, asylum requirements, not just pay money.
Actually since we anyway pay 1000 for premium processing, maybe the fee should be a bit higher for an additional visa itself.

7.5 Billion from just EBs....
If we add qualifying family based - very serious money

Recapture with money or without the money - cannot be the decision of the USCIS. It has to happen legislatively - so we are back to one - meet with the lawmakers!

[tonyHK12]

Recapture with money or without the money - cannot be the decision of the USCIS. It has to happen legislatively - so we are back to one - meet with the lawmakers!

Defenitely we should be in touch with lawmakers, it is legislative. I cleaned up my first post, I was only refering to the second part mentioning border control.
This possible bill can benefit immigrants of all nationalities and get a lot of support, and can quickly fix things.
The other good thing is this can be added in any kind of enforcement bill that people seem to like these days. Extra enforcement can only be done with extra funding...

[amitk81]

I totally agree with meeting with lawmakers etc.

But the major difference between us an illegals is that they don't have a choice, they have to stay here and work no other option.

For Eb community we have other options, going back or other country where talent doesn't have to wait in a line.

that is a fundamental difference we can adapt hence we don't care!

Amit

[willigetgc?]

You are right amit, we do have options, but we do not pursue it.

If we want our green cards, then we have to start caring, because if we don't speak with conviction no one will listen to us.

In spite of all the politics, this country fundamentally works on democratic principles, and we need to use it to our advantage.

[go_guy123]

You are right amit, we do have options, but we do not pursue it.

If we want our green cards, then we have to start caring, because if we don't speak with conviction no one will listen to us.

In spite of all the politics, this country fundamentally works on democratic principles, and we need to use it to our advantage.

Just by asking no one will give what you want. There has to be a strategy.

The legalization of undocumented lobby pretty much threatened the Unions et all into supporting legalization as the masses are big enough to bust union business standoff.
As more business moved to hiring undocumented, it reduced the bargaining power and
drove unions out of certain sectors/professions. The sheet survival itself forced
Unions to support legalization or Dream Act.

Plus teh hispanic community is large enough to act as swing voters in certain states liek Texas , Florida etc

[kumar1305]

of course just by asking nothing is going to happen and just lobbying also nothing is going to happen. The business demand for skill inside the US should improve so the corporate offices will support Legal immigration, Now the Business and Politics are in two poles in the immigration matter. We as minority tax payers have lot of limitations and dependency to influence the Immigrant Legislation.


Then they will ask for increase in H1B visas. Why would they demand for GC?

[Edison99]

I agree with abhishek101 :-)
It is called Vote Bank,

Hispanics are like 7-10% of population. They decide polls in Big states like CA, TX, AZ. Once we have these kind of numbers we can also get this kind of attention.

The biggest point whenever anybody talks aagainst Illegal immigration is how hispanics will punish them in elections. That is why political pundits say that republicans will decline in the long run. I have never heard this for any other group even Chinese.

It is all about Vote Bank

[go_guy123]

Then they will ask for increase in H1B visas. Why would they demand for GC?

This is exactly correct. Unless people refuse to put up the H1B mess , there is no incentive for business to lobby for GC reform. As of now H1B works best, new H1B works his/her a** off for 8 years or so and after he/she cant put in those hour due to various reasons, a new H1B is brought in to the place (use and throw business model).

That is why the GOP wants AgJob or another guest worker for Agri industry and not the Amnesty version. SKILL bill has the best chances as it alighs interests of more
innovation driven IT industry (unlike service based) who like to hire from campuses, universities who want more F1 students in Technology side .

[willigetgc?]

I don't think we "don't" care about the green card - we do, otherwise we would not complain about not getting one. The question is do we care "enough" about it to fight for it?

We have to choices:
1. Do nothing - wait and complain
2. Actively talk to lawmakers, get their support, and convince few of them to sponsor it. It is not easy, but that is the way things are done. Second of all, its better than being passive, complaining and blaming (even when we are right!)

Employers are for increasing the H1B quota and big companies like msft, intel, ibm......have lobbied heavily for it; however, they have not lobbied for the green cards of their own employees who are stuck endlessly in the wait........ H1B works for their business model, and if they care enough about their employees (stuck in gc wait) - they may support - but if we never are vocal about it, there is no incentive for them to help us....

[go_guy123]

I don't think we "don't" care about the green card - we do, otherwise we would not complain about not getting one. The question is do we care "enough" about it to fight for it?

We have to choices:
1. Do nothing - wait and complain
2. Actively talk to lawmakers, get their support, and convince few of them to sponsor it. It is not easy, but that is the way things are done. Second of all, its better than being passive, complaining and blaming (even when we are right!)

Employers are for increasing the H1B quota and big companies like msft, intel, ibm......have lobbied heavily for it; however, they have not lobbied for the green cards of their own employees who are stuck endlessly in the wait........ H1B works for their business model, and if they care enough about their employees (stuck in gc wait) - they may support - but if we never are vocal about it, there is no incentive for them to help us....


If people stop waiting or opting not for endless GC wait, H1b will get less appealing...then only MSFT et al will try for GC reform. Then then they will not be interested.

[dassumi]

With the risk of being called a chronic pessimist, I will have to agree with Shakthisagar's comments. I see the new members of congress and their agenda, it seems to me that no bill will get passed in the lame duck session. To support my stands, check the state of the FDA bill. They did not pass that one and it did not require rocket science to pass.

I have to agree with Peter Seygul when he says that they teach the new members of congress on how to not act on the very things they promised to get the vote bank during the orientation process.


Neither of it. it is pure POLITICS of votes, even if we make noises nothing is going to happen. We have to pay taxes but we cannot vote that is the main reason. and our fellow countrymen dont care, Probably they aleady became aliens! for us.

[tonyHK12]

This is exactly correct. Unless people refuse to put up the H1B mess , there is no incentive for business to lobby for GC reform. As of now H1B works best, new H1B works his/her a** off for 8 years or so and after he/she cant put in those hour due to various reasons, a new H1B is brought in to the place (use and throw business model).

That is why the GOP wants AgJob or another guest worker for Agri industry and not the Amnesty version. SKILL bill has the best chances as it alighs interests of more
innovation driven IT industry (unlike service based) who like to hire from campuses, universities who want more F1 students in Technology side .

Nobody wants to come in on a H-1b and leave in 5-6 years after working here. Mostly only those who are into outsourcing or contract labor would want to use this as just a temporary work visa.
So increasing the H1bs, while not the GC EB visas is exactly promoting the outsourcing and contract workforce man power, which is counter-productive to preserving jobs.
No company hiring a perm employee wants to let them leave after 3 years and get a new one and start re-training from scratch.
But does anyone really care ?

[tonyHK12]

No company hiring a perm employee wants to let them leave after 3 years and get a new one and start re-training from scratch.


But what if they delay the GC process, create a fiasco, add EAD renewal, that way companies can keep permanent employees for a much longer period and save money on salary.

[kumar4875]

.
No company hiring a perm employee wants to let them leave after 3 years and get a new one and start re-training from scratch.
But does anyone really care ?[/QUOTE]

Not true at all.depends on the kind of work i.e for a small learning curve jobs like QA testing, code maintenance jobs etc
the place where i am working --My manager is willing to get a cheaper rate consultant and train him. It makes him save some budget dollars and may be get him bonus.

[imh1b]

All the pseudo intellectuals on this thread against Illegal Immigration need to do a reality check. You guys just sit on your chair and post your worthless opinions that are not even worth 2 cents. See what Dream Act people are doing around you. Have you done even 1 % of what they have done.

Can you do this?

Hunger Strike
Local DREAM Act Students Continue Hunger Strike Outside LA Offices of Senator Dianne Feinstein - Orange County News - Navel Gazing (http://blogs.ocweekly.com/navelgazing/2010/07/local_dream_act_students_conti.php)

Step out of the shadows and your anonymous IDs
Undocumented students step "Out of the Shadows" at WestConn - NewsTimes (http://www.newstimes.com/news/article/Undocumented-students-step-Out-of-the-Shadows-862352.php)

How many of you are best and the brightest professors or studied in US universities. Have you been able to get your professors to support you?
Brown professors to join students urging DREAM Act - Boston.com (http://www.boston.com/news/local/connecticut/articles/2010/11/27/brown_professors_to_join_students_urging_dream_act/)

Are we doing Rally in each city for visa recapture?
Local Students: Keep The DREAM Act Alive | Progress Illinois (http://progressillinois.com/quick-hits/content/2010/09/23/local-students-keep-dream-act-alive)

How many organizations support us? Even our own websites people on other websites out hate messages against IV. Leave alone supporting.
Find a local organization | DREAM Act Portal (http://dreamact.info/advocacy/organizations)

More Rally
Local Immigrants Rally for DREAM Act | United States | Epoch Times (http://www.theepochtimes.com/n2/content/view/46716/)


Just Type in Google about Dream Act and see how much people are doing. And what are we doing? Shame on us. We do not deserve any Recapture. It is frustrating.

[sage2006]

Very well put immh1b.
We just keep repeatedly analyzing and then re-analyzing facts which are already out there and which everyone is aware of (hispanic caucus, business angle etc etc). The real discussion should be how we overcome these challenges and get our voice heard instead of patting ourself on the back for merely understanding the issue.

there was a conf call yesterday about how to push forward with the "I485 filing without current PD initiative" (info about this was posted several times by nmdial on several threads) and there were 5 participants. Thats the status of our "grass-roots" initiative


All the pseudo intellectuals on this thread against Illegal Immigration need to do a reality check. You guys just sit on your chair and post your worthless opinions that are not even worth 2 cents. See what Dream Act people are doing around you. Have you done even 1 % of what they have done.

Can you do this?

Hunger Strike
Local DREAM Act Students Continue Hunger Strike Outside LA Offices of Senator Dianne Feinstein - Orange County News - Navel Gazing (http://blogs.ocweekly.com/navelgazing/2010/07/local_dream_act_students_conti.php)

Step out of the shadows and your anonymous IDs
Undocumented students step "Out of the Shadows" at WestConn - NewsTimes (http://www.newstimes.com/news/article/Undocumented-students-step-Out-of-the-Shadows-862352.php)

How many of you are best and the brightest professors or studied in US universities. Have you been able to get your professors to support you?
Brown professors to join students urging DREAM Act - Boston.com (http://www.boston.com/news/local/connecticut/articles/2010/11/27/brown_professors_to_join_students_urging_dream_act/)

Are we doing Rally in each city for visa recapture?
Local Students: Keep The DREAM Act Alive | Progress Illinois (http://progressillinois.com/quick-hits/content/2010/09/23/local-students-keep-dream-act-alive)

How many organizations support us? Even our own websites people on other websites out hate messages against IV. Leave alone supporting.
Find a local organization | DREAM Act Portal (http://dreamact.info/advocacy/organizations)

More Rally
Local Immigrants Rally for DREAM Act | United States | Epoch Times (http://www.theepochtimes.com/n2/content/view/46716/)


Just Type in Google about Dream Act and see how much people are doing. And what are we doing? Shame on us. We do not deserve any Recapture. It is frustrating.

[desi3933]

.... If you are a Legal tax payer, you deserve to be treated differenlty than this Illegals. is it not?

You need to do reality check. May be this a good read for you ...
Amazon.com: Lobbying and Policy Change: Who Wins, Who Loses, and Why (9780226039459): Frank R. Baumgartner, Jeffrey M. Berry, Marie Hojnacki, David C. Kimball, Beth L. Leech: Books (http://www.amazon.com/Lobbying-Policy-Change-Wins-Loses/dp/0226039455/ref=tmm_pap_title_0)



________________
Not a legal advice.

[waitingnwaiting]

No doubt, all these are true indeed, but one thing we all should remember why we should do all these things, we are 100 % LEGAL, paying taxes as good as any other US citizen, If you are a Legal tax payer, you deserve to be treated differenlty than this Illegals. is it not?

We can put 'Legal document' on our tee shirt and chant I am 100% legal all day.
Nobody will care for us. We can stay legal on H1B for 50 years and pay taxes every years. Who cares why should they give a green card. If we go back 10 more people from India are willing to come in our place. We have to do rallies, TV interviews and lobby in every city. Instead of so called intelligent folks keep chanting 'I am legal' on forums.

[willigetgc?]

Immigrant students give blood to show citizenship (http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5g2WOuvYeto9C4UY9VinB-cQ1nlYQ?docId=a748307804024e81a3d72c813aea18d9)
Immigrant advocates have staged sit-ins, held rallies and gone on hunger strikes in recent days in an 11th hour bid to get Congress to pass legislation that would give illegal immigrants a pathway to citizenship by going to college or serving in the military.

As Congress gets closers to a possible vote on the bill, called the DREAM Act, college-aged illegal immigrants are literally shedding blood for the cause.

On Friday, a group of illegal immigrant college students, or "DREAMers" as they called themselves, donated blood at Harvard University and other colleges. The students said they wanted to show the rest of the country that they are ready to perform community service and are good citizens, even if they don't have U.S. citizenship.

"As someone who is undocumented ... I'm not scared about giving blood," said Megha Sharma, 22, whose family came to Massachusetts from India seven years ago and who donated blood Friday for the first time. "I'm scared about the vote in Congress."

The DREAM Act is in the pile of legislation awaiting action in the final days of the current Congress.

Myrna Orozco, a 20-year-old from Kansas City, Mo., who is spearheading the national effort, said supporters have been donating blood in the name of the cause for about two weeks. So far, she said "DREAMers" have given blood in California, Kansas, Kentucky, Missouri, Texas and Virginia, with more states targeted in the coming days.

Orozco, who was brought to the U.S. from Mexico as a child, donated blood Friday at Donnelly College in Kansas City, Kansas, where she is a student.

"I'm type O," she said. "So everybody can take my blood."

Nothing prevents illegal immigrants from giving blood and blood-collection workers don't check immigration status, said Red Cross spokeswoman Stephanie Millian. She said all blood donors just need to show identification and fill out health questionnaires.

Steve Kropper, co-director of the Massachusetts Coalition for Immigration Reform, a bipartisan group that seeks immigration reductions, said the whole episode showed that authorities have the tools to identify immigrants who were unlawfully in the country.

"This is a missed opportunity. We know where they are enrolled in school. We know where they live," said Kropper. "Shouldn't we be taking advantage of this?"

Renata Teodoro, 22, who led the delegation to the blood drive at Harvard University, said the idea of donating blood came after immigrant students started calling on each other to promote good citizenship by performing community service during the holidays.

"DREAMers all over have been doing community services," said Teodoro, who was a child when her family unlawfully brought her to the U.S. from Brazil. "We want to continue giving back to this country because we do love this country and we do consider ourselves to be Americans. We're just fighting for our right to be acknowledged as Americans."

In addition to donating blood, student immigrants are volunteering at homeless shelters and donating turkeys at holiday food drives. Orozco said one group in Kentucky held a food drive outside a congressman's office and then went to donate blood next door.

"This is not the first time I'm donating," said Elizabeth Ponce, 20, who gave blood at Harvard. "It probably won't be the last."

U.S. Sen. John Kerry, D-Mass., said the students "are reminding everyone what it really means to be an American."

"Only three in a hundred Americans will ever donate blood despite the need, but these kids are living out the real full measure of citizenship," he said. "They're living, breathing testimony of the importance of passing the DREAM Act."

Marie Parente, a former Massachusetts state representative who opposed efforts to give the state's illegal immigrants in-state tuition, said the blood donation drive did little to change her opinion that the DREAM Act was wrong. She compared illegal immigrants donating blood to win sympathy with serial killers donating blood to get off death row.

"What if a guy on death row says 'I'll give you a pint of blood for the rest of my life ... just get me out of here'?" said Parente, 82, of Milford. "It's baseless."

Orozco said illegal immigrant students have nothing in common with criminals and the immigrants are just seeking to go to college or join the military.

"Our blood is just as good as other people's blood," said Orozco.

[desigirl]

Agreed with you one part "just simply INTELLiGENT FOLKS saying I am Legal are not going to make any difference." may be that came out of frustrations. But after doing at least some lobbying or some kind of campaign nothing solid seems to be happening, nobody even talking about Legals. Acually no one wants us everyone wants our money as tax and other things. Whatever we lobby unless job situation improves Nothing is going to happen it seems. And comparing DREAM supporters and us is really comparing apples to Oranges.

What we are doing is not enough. We cannot match even slightly what the Dream Activists have done. We have followed the rules, and we are waiting for years - our frustrations are real. But our efforts for getting the fix is lack lustre. If you take the example of sending the letters to the lawmaker and president - how many of us have done so repeatedly? how many of us have forwarded it to other friends/co-workers everyday? how many of us have gotten the standard responses without a mention of what we addressed in our letters - and followed up with our Senators or Representatives, and said - "Listen, I am talking of legal immigrants and visa recapture - and you are talking a different issue?" Few of us have, but how many of our 50,000+ members have done it?

Once again, I say, We have followed the rules, and we are waiting for years - our frustrations are real. But our efforts for getting the fix is lack lustre, and so is the response we get! We are in dream land if we believe that we can get "solid" results for "at least some lobbying" or "some kind of campaign" - think about it.

[tonyHK12]

most of them don't care attitude until and unless they are personally affected. Its very difficult to make some one to do for their own benefit, Until they really care. that was the moral of the story.
.

Yes thats true, most legal immgirants are like this and possibly humans in general too. People only do things when they are desperate like illegals. We have to come up with new ideas to get people to participate.

One defenition of Insanity:
"Doing the same thing again and again and yet expecting a different result"

[willigetgc?]

After seeing some of the posts on other threads on why "recapture" was not part of the dream bill - I feel that I need to keep this thread active.............

Not because I care about dream activists, but because to show our community that we need the same kind of dedication to get our relief.

http://immigrationvoice.org/forum/2175464-post1.html
http://immigrationvoice.org/forum/2194067-post30.html

United we stand, divided we fall. I ask this of every member who comes on to this platform - If you believe in IV team - do what they ask of you. If you don't believe in what IV team is doing, then there are plenty of other forums, don't waste your time here or spread discontent here.

And before any one wants to talk of democracy, - pls - democracy survives only when there are active participants (and when I say active participants - some one who is actually doing something constructive and not just posting on threads annonymously.)

[gvenkat]

Not trying to make this in to a EB3 vs EB2. The reality is everyone other than EB3-I gets a GC at the maximum of 5-6 years which is not a bad wait.

USCIS/Lawmakers/politicians does not fell the need to be obligated to a minuscule population that is EB3-I and provide relief for them.

There should be a concrete effort to educate the lawmakers to know that the immigration system is not what they think it is. I'm 100% sure that about half of them would not know all this mumbo-jumbo about eb3,quotas etc.

The other bad thing the US immigration policy does is to provide a GC for a future job whereas countries all over the world provide GC if you stay in the country, pay taxes and contribute to the economy, which is utterly ridiculos.

What would be % of folks stuck in EB3-I category? Very less I would think. So they let us rot and die. Simple. Unless the EB discrimination goes away nothing will happen.

Thats my vent and rant for the friday. Have a nice weekend.

[willigetgc?]

This morning, with millions of immigrants and immigrant rights supporters watching, the Senate failed to reach the 60 votes necessary to move forward on the DREAM Act. Although this particular vote was lost, I think the actions of the amazing Dreamers after the vote provide an example for all of us moving forward. This month these students dropped everything, some in the middle of their final exams, and came to Washington, DC in the greatest lobbying effort many have ever seen. Day in and day out they sang DREAM carols in 15 degree weather, practiced military drills on the capitol grounds, staged “study-ins” in the Senate cafeteria, and constantly worked the halls of Congress. Last night one student remarked, “For the first time today a Senator approached us in the hallway rather than us approaching them. They knew who we were, we’re the Dreamers.”

In a political world where individual voices are lost in the partisan shuffle and many are struck with disillusionment and apathy, these young leaders spoke out and taught all of us a lesson in true heart and inspiration. Following the vote, rather than acting with resignation or anger, they gathered in the Senate atrium to pray and do their DREAM Army chant one last time before leaving:

“How do you feel? Motivated, dedicated, DOWNRIGHT EDUCATED! You can check us out!”

It is their strength and ability to mobilize that makes these students so incredible, but it is their determination to keep their heads held high and continue fighting for justice that makes them leaders.

We are all deeply disappointed in some of our country’s leaders today. I ask you to keep in mind these Dreamers and their ability to keep up the good fight. We have learned that this movement can change hearts and minds through passionate mobilizing efforts. There were a few unexpected “Yes” votes today, including four Democrats who voted against the DREAM Act just two years ago. It was the strength of our movement that won these votes and we should be proud of these victories.

As you continue to reflect and we move into a new year, remember that it is our responsibility as advocates to keep moving forward. It is our responsibility to never give up.

Our grassroot efforts are less than 1% of the dreamers! Their attitude of "never give up" shows their dedication.

[looivy]

Our grassroot efforts are less than 1% of the dreamers! Their attitude of "never give up" shows their dedication.

Dude, the reality is that when you have 2 million Dreamers, we will pale in comparison any day. Dreamers are mostly students who have a natural inclination to show up at events. EBs on the other hand have a frikkin job and your manager will be after your ass if you do not deliver or show up in meetings and sh$%.

We do not have a gameplan other than reach out to your local reps and senators. I have done it and others have done it. It did promote awareness among a few reps and senators. What we need is a better strategy?

Pardon my ignorance around how lobbying works, but IV leaders need to come up with a clear strategy that says to the effect that we are targeting senators/reps X, Y and Z and need $## K in lobbying efforts for next 6 months. Please contribute. We need a champion for legals and it better be a republican because you ain't getting sh#% from Dems. Durbin is the biggest D-bag of 'em all.

Once we have an example of success, it will defnitely boost contributions (both monetary and hours and energy) from our members. We haven't had any success since July 2007.

Peace.

[hpandey]

Dude, the reality is that when you have 2 million Dreamers, we will pale in comparison any day. Dreamers are mostly students who have a natural inclination to show up at events. EBs on the other hand have a frikkin job and your manager will be after your ass if you do not deliver or show up in meetings and sh$%.

We do not have a gameplan other than reach out to your local reps and senators. I have done it and others have done it. It did promote awareness among a few reps and senators. What we need is a better strategy?

Pardon my ignorance around how lobbying works, but IV leaders need to come up with a clear strategy that says to the effect that we are targeting senators/reps X, Y and Z and need $## K in lobbying efforts for next 6 months. Please contribute. We need a champion for legals and it better be a republican because you ain't getting sh#% from Dems. Durbin is the biggest D-bag of 'em all.

Once we have an example of success, it will defnitely boost contributions (both monetary and hours and energy) from our members. We haven't had any success since July 2007.

Peace.

You are right about the difference between dreamers and EB based immigrants. I agree with you . Having so many students ( millions ) with so much free time and social networking skills no wonder they are more vocal and besides they have more backing from the Hispanic caucus and funds from those sources. IV in terms of members or money is nowhere near that . Anyway I don't think any amount of money can get a bill passed in this political atmosphere.

[willigetgc?]

Dude, the reality is that when you have 2 million Dreamers, we will pale in comparison any day. Dreamers are mostly students who have a natural inclination to show up at events. EBs on the other hand have a frikkin job and your manager will be after your ass if you do not deliver or show up in meetings and sh$%.

We do not have a gameplan other than reach out to your local reps and senators. I have done it and others have done it. It did promote awareness among a few reps and senators. What we need is a better strategy?

Pardon my ignorance around how lobbying works, but IV leaders need to come up with a clear strategy that says to the effect that we are targeting senators/reps X, Y and Z and need $## K in lobbying efforts for next 6 months. Please contribute. We need a champion for legals and it better be a republican because you ain't getting sh#% from Dems. Durbin is the biggest D-bag of 'em all.

Once we have an example of success, it will defnitely boost contributions (both monetary and hours and energy) from our members. We haven't had any success since July 2007.

Peace.

Two notes:
1. You can target a few legislators - but in the end game it gives no results - eg: dream act! You need more than 60 votes to pass in the current situation (+ more, with the fickle mindedness + elections and keep your seat tactic).
2. If you are meeting with your lawmaker on a regular basis - good for you (and us). My spouse and I take turns to meet with our lawmaker each month - 2 hrs off /month.
We can't match the dreamers but we hardly do enough either! We ask for rallies, lobby day, results but we don't put the efforts needed to succeed...That was my point.

[looivy]

You are right about the difference between dreamers and EB based immigrants. I agree with you . Having so many students ( millions ) with so much free time and social networking skills no wonder they are more vocal and besides they have more backing from the Hispanic caucus and funds from those sources. IV in terms of members or money is nowhere near that . Anyway I don't think any amount of money can get a bill passed in this political atmosphere.

Repubicans have gotten laws passed on their terms (tax cut for example). Repeal of DADT would have a polictical suicide for those Repubs who voted yes if they had voted No. It is all about negotiations when it comes time to passing Laws. Repubs have always been about legal immigration. Dems on the other hand are after vote bank.

Since repubs will control house in the next session, having a republican champion our issue is an optimal strategy. It may make sense to start with Jason Chaffetz from Utah atleast mentioned EBs when DREAM was being discussed. You will need money lobbying to repubs and that is what IV should focus on.

Just my 2 cents.

[eastindia]

Repubicans have gotten laws passed on their terms (tax cut for example). Repeal of DADT would have a polictical suicide for those Repubs who voted yes if they had voted No. It is all about negotiations when it comes time to passing Laws. Repubs have always been about legal immigration. Dems on the other hand are after vote bank.

Since repubs will control house in the next session, having a republican champion our issue is an optimal strategy. It may make sense to start with Jason Chaffetz from Utah atleast mentioned EBs when DREAM was being discussed. You will need money lobbying to repubs and that is what IV should focus on.

Just my 2 cents.

Your non existent 2 cents cannot lobby. You need more than posts.

[eastindia]

Repubicans have gotten laws passed on their terms (tax cut for example). Repeal of DADT would have a polictical suicide for those Repubs who voted yes if they had voted No. It is all about negotiations when it comes time to passing Laws. Repubs have always been about legal immigration. Dems on the other hand are after vote bank.

Since repubs will control house in the next session, having a republican champion our issue is an optimal strategy. It may make sense to start with Jason Chaffetz from Utah atleast mentioned EBs when DREAM was being discussed. You will need money lobbying to repubs and that is what IV should focus on.

Just my 2 cents.

Have you met him yet? Or you are only giving all your 2 cents advice?

[immig4me]

Repubicans have gotten laws passed on their terms (tax cut for example). Repeal of DADT would have a polictical suicide for those Repubs who voted yes if they had voted No. It is all about negotiations when it comes time to passing Laws. Repubs have always been about legal immigration. Dems on the other hand are after vote bank.

Since repubs will control house in the next session, having a republican champion our issue is an optimal strategy. It may make sense to start with Jason Chaffetz from Utah atleast mentioned EBs when DREAM was being discussed. You will need money lobbying to repubs and that is what IV should focus on.

Just my 2 cents.

2 cents won't deliver the laws we want! We do need a legislator who will sponsor our bill - if it is a republican - so be it.