Better Hourly Rates after EAD. Possible??

[valuablehurdle]

Hello Everyone,

I am back again. This forum is outstanding when it comes to reliable information....

I work for a reputed US Consulting firm. They under-pay you and make you over work. They market fake resumes in a polished way. YES... IT is TRUE. Don't just blame the desi consultants.

I am on a EAD. I wanted to switch to hourly basis and wanted to see if there are any direct vendors who would be ready to pay better rates. Desi Consulting Co. is out of question. From my experience, Robert Half is bad too. Is there a better way to market yourself..to the employer?

Any help will be appreciated. !!

[karthkc]

The hard part about a consulting position in your scenario is the ability to keep your project pipeline flowing.

If you are in a field like say SAP where the demand is always there, its easier to market yourself without too much effort.

My personal opinion, note your skillsets, see if they are hot in the market and if so, keep your options flexible and try to market directly. If you are not comfortable networking or being in constant touch with resources that can help you with an opportunity, then consult under a firm...

[n2b]

Hello Everyone,

I am back again. This forum is outstanding when it comes to reliable information....

I work for a reputed US Consulting firm. They under-pay you and make you over work. They market fake resumes in a polished way. YES... IT is TRUE. Don't just blame the desi consultants.

I am on a EAD. I wanted to switch to hourly basis and wanted to see if there are any direct vendors who would be ready to pay better rates. Desi Consulting Co. is out of question. From my experience, Robert Half is bad too. Is there a better way to market yourself..to the employer?

Any help will be appreciated. !!

It would make more sense to compare and brainstorm if you can post the skillset you have in mind and the rate you wish for?

I agree that being on EAD or having a GC puts a person in a better situation compared to H1B but the bottom line is the skillset in context, demand for that skillset and expertise that one has in that skillset.

[snathan]

It would make more sense to compare and brainstorm if you can post the skillset you have in mind and the rate you wish for?

I agree that being on EAD or having a GC puts a person in a better situation compared to H1B but the bottom line is the skillset in context, demand for that skillset and expertise that one has in that skillset.

it depends on the skill set and your experience. I accept the fact being on EAD or GC will give advantages. But I dont think GC only make the wonders. you might get 10-20% extra.

[royus77]

you might get 10-20% extra.

This is good enough as 10-20 % will increase your savings by 30-50 %

[valuablehurdle]

I am into Datawarehousing and BI. Worked in multiple technology such as Oracle BI, Cognos, Informatica. It is frustrating to see my mid-size American Consulting Company charging the client a $180 per hour while I get $85K per annum. I cannot even switch to my client since I have signed a non-compete agreement..... I think direct marketing is the best way to augment your rates....

[jayleno]

Oh you are back!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! yay...we all have been looing for ya. How have you been??????? :) :D
Try Indeed.com


Hello Everyone,

I am back again. This forum is outstanding when it comes to reliable information....

I work for a reputed US Consulting firm. They under-pay you and make you over work. They market fake resumes in a polished way. YES... IT is TRUE. Don't just blame the desi consultants.

I am on a EAD. I wanted to switch to hourly basis and wanted to see if there are any direct vendors who would be ready to pay better rates. Desi Consulting Co. is out of question. From my experience, Robert Half is bad too. Is there a better way to market yourself..to the employer?

Any help will be appreciated. !!

[sanju]

I am into Datawarehousing and BI. Worked in multiple technology such as Oracle BI, Cognos, Informatica. It is frustrating to see my mid-size American Consulting Company charging the client a $180 per hour while I get $85K per annum. I cannot even switch to my client since I have signed a non-compete agreement..... I think direct marketing is the best way to augment your rates....


Well, I like you because you are just a straight shooter. If you are such a straight shooter then let me do some straight talk, so just catch this.

Your American mid-size company or Desi small size or super size company will get $180/hr but you will not get even $50/hr from the same client even when you go direct. So no matter how "highly-skilled" you think you are, your non-compete argument is not good enough for you not to be able directly market yourself, because there are gazillion other companies using BI, Cognos, BO, Informatica, Datastage and every similar crap. You can impress a few people by naming some technologies that maybe hot but they don't mean a &hit if you market them yourself. Here is why. A lot of people blame the lack of GC as a reason to be exploited. That is part of the problem. The other part of the problem is that most hiring managers in large companies get commission from these small, mid-size or large American, Desi or European consulting companies. That's why in most cases they always hire through one of these companies. They will not hire directly because the manager thinks you to be a stingy desi, and if he hires you directly the hiring manager will not see a dime, so why will he hire you directly? This is a big cycle of corruption and everybody is part of it including lawmakers who get contributions from lobbyist/representatives of these small, mid and large size companies. You think lawmakers don't know what is going on? You think client doesn't know that you make 85K when the middle company get $180/hr? You think the big-bosses at the company/client doesn't know that the hiring managers are getting favors from middle companies? You think lawmakers doesn't know that immigrant worker waiting for long delayed GC is bonded to an employer that buys employee retention insurance policy for the employer? They all know it. But you see every player in this movie, you, your hiring boss at the client site, the middle company, the lobbyist, the lawmaker and many more, they are all being paid from that $180/hr which you think that you are entitled for because you know Oracle BI and Congnos. Do you realize how easy this ETL, Informatica bull &hit is but somehow you seem to think that its worth $180/hr. And you seem to think that your problem is that other than you, everybody else around you is faking resumes. If you are so smart answer this, how will you avoid using two bitmap index on two columns in two tables when used in the same query? And why would you want to avoid using both the bitmap indexes? Na Na, now don't go to Asktom.com to look for an answer, you are highly skilled, you deserve $180/hr for knowing Congnos and Informatica, shouldn't you be knowing atleast this.

Sorry, did not mean to put you on the spot, just trying to highlight that the problem in this entire debate is, every player in the picture stands up for his/her position always trying to project self-righteous image highlighting the part of the movie in which he or she is the hero and all others are villains. And BTW, now some "super-genius" branic at IEEE - some Ron Hira or NumberUSA or someone with the name Matloff will selectively cut paste from yours or mine post and use it to prove his/her agenda to make name and career for himself as if he is the savior of the world and ALL IMMIGRANTS are evil. And the story goes on and people continue to wait for something to happen when the cycle of corruption continues.... Best of luck my friend, you sure should get $180/hr on EAD, GC and when you are a citizen. It the turn of the idiots at Programmers Guild to read this thread thinking why they are not getting $180/hr. And those geniuses still don't get.... and they blame us for their problems. Well, its not their fault, they have to find and label some group of people as their enemy before they can play a victim card to get some sympathy and relief from nationalistic group of politicians.

[krishna.ahd]

Well, I like you because you are just a straight shooter. If you are such a straight shooter then let me do some straight talk, so just catch this.

Your American mid-size company or Desi small size or super size company will get $180/hr but you will not get even $50/hr from the same client even when you go direct. So no matter how "highly-skilled" you think you are, your non-compete argument is not good enough for you not to be able directly market yourself, because there are gazillion other companies using BI, Cognos, BO, Informatica, Datastage and every similar crap. You can impress a few people by naming some technologies that maybe hot but they don't mean a &hit if you market them yourself. Here is why. A lot of people blame the lack of GC as a reason to be exploited. That is part of the problem. The other part of the problem is that most hiring managers in large companies get commission from these small, mid-size or large American, Desi or European consulting companies. That's why in most cases they always hire through one of these companies. They will not hire directly because the manager thinks you to be a stingy desi, and if he hires you directly the hiring manager will not see a dime, so why will he hire you directly? This is a big cycle of corruption and everybody is part of it including lawmakers who get contributions from lobbyist/representatives of these small, mid and large size companies. You think lawmakers don't know what is going on? You think client doesn't know that you make 85K when the middle company get $180/hr? You think the big-bosses at the company/client doesn't know that the hiring managers are getting favors from middle companies? You think lawmakers doesn't know that immigrant worker waiting for long delayed GC is bonded to an employer that buys employee retention insurance policy for the employer? They all know it. But you see every player in this movie, you, your hiring boss at the client site, the middle company, the lobbyist, the lawmaker and many more, they are all being paid from that $180/hr which you think that you are entitled for because you know Oracle BI and Congnos. Do you realize how easy this ETL, Informatica bull &hit is but somehow you seem to think that its worth $180/hr. And you seem to think that your problem is that other than you, everybody else around you is faking resumes. If you are so smart answer this, how will you avoid using two bitmap index on two columns in two tables when used in the same query? And why would you want to avoid using both the bitmap indexes? Na Na, now don't go to Asktom.com to look for an answer, you are highly skilled, you deserve $180/hr for knowing Congnos and Informatica, shouldn't you be knowing atleast this.

Sorry, did not mean to put you on the spot, just trying to highlight that the problem in this entire debate is, every player in the picture stands up for his/her position always trying to project self-righteous image highlighting the part of the movie in which he or she is the hero and all others are villains. And BTW, now some "super-genius" branic at IEEE - some Ron Hira or NumberUSA or someone with the name Matloff will selectively cut paste from yours or mine post and use it to prove his/her agenda to make name and career for himself as if he is the savior of the world and ALL IMMIGRANTS are evil. And the story goes on and people continue to wait for something to happen when the cycle of corruption continues.... Best of luck my friend, you sure should get $180/hr on EAD, GC and when you are a citizen. It the turn of the idiots at Programmers Guild to read this thread thinking why they are not getting $180/hr. And those geniuses still don't get.... and they blame us for their problems. Well, its not their fault, they have to find and label some group of people as their enemy before they can play a victim card to get some sympathy and relief from nationalistic group of politicians.
Very Well Said Sanju . ( not to offend valuablehurdle or infact anyone else )

Yes GC/EAD gives to room to look around / negotiate the higher rate , to sustain and move up will require a lot more than that.

Look at the aveage compansation for any area.
Assess your expertise ( not to compare with you the guy sitting next to you)
Try to move up in the ladder
Keep updating your tech skill
Diversify to more ( but related ) skill.
Add niche like PMP / Six Sigma.

Top of all , little bit of Luck , to be right place at the right time .

I dont think , i have mentioned anything here extra ordinary , only "CS"

Wish you good luck

[alapkd]

Well, I like you because you are just a straight shooter. If you are such a straight shooter then let me do some straight talk, so just catch this.



what makes you think hiring managers eat commission? are you a hiring manager? you think in such big hierarchies in big companies few people who are doing hiring can actually eat commissions lol. you think it works like indian police department where havaladar collects money and buys bidi for fellow havaldars and buys 2 for himself and gives the rest to his sub inspector who in turn gives to inspector and so on and so on? if that was the case one would not want to get promoted to anything other than the idiotic role of hiring manager of consultants. that is the most idiotic thing i have ever heard. there could be few exceptional bad apples but with any descent sized reputable company a manager would risk going to jail and being sued by employer and future life and career screwed if he eats commission like that. i have seen people getting fired and stripped naked for doing this again incidentaly some desis who attempted it. there would be lot of other real or perceived services provided by consulting companies which are keeping a huge chunk of the hourly rate and will keep the person on bench for descent time give other benefits train them and yes with this kind of idiotic software packages train some guy picked up from the street and put him to work. if someone gets a job like that he should be more than happy with 55/hour. dont know what is the educational background of this gentleman who has started the thread but i would like to know what makes him so super special to earn salary of say even 150/hour or 100/hour out of what he thinks is the billing rate of 180/hour that will propel him to about top 3% earners in the economy.

[valuablehurdle]

It was Hard-Hitting, Sanju !!!
Anyway, I feel there are bad apples......but not all take commissions.

Still, I am at a loss to understand the same company that pays $180 per hour to the American Consulting company will pay me only as much as $50/hr.

What would be their logic?

I would appreciate your replies...

[valuablehurdle]

Just for ALKPD....


I donot think I deserve $180/hr.... Right now I make $85K plus a 10% bonus.

You are missing the point. I do NOT think I am SPECIAL. I have an MBA from a US reputed Univ. plus 5 years of experience... I do assessment of their existing IT systems and give recommendations.

My logic is differrent.. This is valid for US born people too. WHY would a company pay $180 an hour to a consulting Co. for the same skill-sets.... however, when you go to them directly they will just pay you $60-$70.

[guru76]

One of the reasons is that the hiring company is relying on the fact that the consulting company will provide a steady supply of consultants as soon as possible when needed. From the hiring company's point of view, the reputation of the consultant is as good as the reputation of the consulting company.

[alapkd]

Just for ALKPD....


I donot think I deserve $180/hr.... Right now I make $85K plus a 10% bonus.

You are missing the point. I do NOT think I am SPECIAL. I have an MBA from a US reputed Univ. plus 5 years of experience... I do assessment of their existing IT systems and give recommendations.

My logic is differrent.. This is valid for US born people too. WHY would a company pay $180 an hour to a consulting Co. for the same skill-sets.... however, when you go to them directly they will just pay you $60-$70.


if the difference is really that big than seriously i fail to understand it, they might be accounting for lot of other things like travel expense and other benefits that they might be providing but if the spread is as big as you are saying then it surely does not make sense. if this has anything to do with SOX then consulting company might be guaranteeing lot of things and might have legal liabilities if that is not the case then it is unexplainable.

although i strongly refute the possibility that hiring managers are eating money because just like any beauracracy few guys cant keep benefiting without sharing the benefits and no descent company will tolerate that kind of culture there could be isolated instances but when they are found out they are very severely punished and their life becomes that of a dog running from here to there because in most industries if you are working for a certain domain people know each other and reputation travels faster than light especially bad reputation.

[solaris27]

cut middle layer and make more

[sanju]

although i strongly refute the possibility that hiring managers are eating money

Trust me my friend, I have seen it happen all the time, from large Telecom firm to Govt., its always there, most of the consultants just doesn't come to know about it, but the cut for the managers is there in some form, almost always. Why do each manager has a specific vendor through whom they want to hire most of the time? What else is the reason for the client to pay the consulting company $180/hr but they won't give 'valueablehurdle' anything more than $50-60/hr?

On a different note, now that NSG approved the waiver, most desi uncles, some of them are also owners of desi consulting companies will claim that they are the father of Nuclear deal. These bastards (sorry for my french) always oppose any GC fix and they tell their favorite congressman/senator (each has atleast one favorite politician for whom they do fund raisers) that gc backlog is not an important issue for the community. India Abroad, Times of India, rediff and other desi portals/newspapers will write 'Oliver North' style stories about these desi uncles knowing well that companies like GE etc put their weight behind the deal as it will create commerce to commerce over $20 billion/yr. But desi uncles/orgs will not stop claiming to be the father of nuclear deal. The fact is, most of these desi uncles made noise not because they wanted to do something for their country of birth, they are doing it because they think that if the nuclear deal passes, they can play middle man for US companies to sell the technology/material to Indian companies/govt. Most of the so called 'united voice of Indian-Americans on the Hill' organization's goal is to make big bucks by playing 'middle man' for companies wanting to sell technology to India. And as always, just as 'valuablehurdle''s client (paying $180/hr) Indian govt. will pay double the cost. These desi companies have squeezed blood of people waiting for gc, but now they think its time to move on to play big game with the big boys. These desi uncles/orgs are going nuclear.... time for Rediff and India Abroad to play Oliver North. Sometimes the line between capitalism and cycle of corruption is extremely blur. The problem is, these desi uncles/orgs claim to be representatives of entire Indian-American community, sometimes the entire immigrant community. They don't know more than 100 people, but they claim to be the leaders of all 2.5 million indian americans. Sorry for my french, but these bastards are the owners of desi consulting firms who have done a lot of harm to many communities.

[gveerab]

US economy is designed this way, everyone will get their own share. No one bothers about optimizing the chain and reducing the cost. If they do that whole economy will collapse. If people started sticking to one marriage and stop taking the divorces, these lawyers will not have work and that portion of economy will collapse. If you have time please watch this video

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4343898391323537541&hl=en

you will know more about US economy.

:D



I am into Datawarehousing and BI. Worked in multiple technology such as Oracle BI, Cognos, Informatica. It is frustrating to see my mid-size American Consulting Company charging the client a $180 per hour while I get $85K per annum. I cannot even switch to my client since I have signed a non-compete agreement..... I think direct marketing is the best way to augment your rates....

[whiteStallion]

Thanks Sanju for bringing this up...
From my experience, I have seen the hiring managers being hand-in-glove with the Consulting companies(both desi and non-desi) from which they frequently hire...these consulting companies get the most favored status for every opening that hiring manager publishes... And I'm not talking about some non-descript company...I'm talking about Fortune 100 companies...
@alapkd -> Unfortunately they hardly get caught...

When a Consulting company is being hired to do a job, they take the responsibility of things going wrong...they are also hired for a fairly defined time...These are few reasons why they are paid high...also bigger the company, bigger the overhead costs...you are sponsoring a lot of cost centers dept from what you earn....
Try independent consulting to get a better share of your earning....

[alapkd]

@alapkd -> Unfortunately they hardly get caught...



think about it if it was just paying a cut to the management to get your person hired wont ur competitor do the same. i have seen ppl getting caught because the competitor came to know of this and got really pissed and spread it around and the manager got screwed. most of the big companies have very strict policy for even gifts acceptance and the kind of gifts and amounts of it. i m sure it still happens but it can not be as widespread as ppl think it would be. which vendor to use is determined by someone really high up. most companies also keep a track of how much the primary vendor is getting out of the deal and there is a cap on it. they ask for the legal contract to check what % primary vendor is keeping so primary vendor cant fool the company and underpay the consultant and keep a hefty chunk for themselves.

all i can say is if you see a manager who is involved in illegal practice of taking kick backs expose that guy and get him fired it is your responsibility and it can be done.

[singam]

US economy is designed this way, everyone will get their own share. No one bothers about optimizing the chain and reducing the cost. If they do that whole economy will collapse. If people started sticking to one marriage and stop taking the divorces, these lawyers will not have work and that portion of economy will collapse. If you have time please watch this video

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4343898391323537541&hl=en

you will know more about US economy.

:D

Awesome lecture by Mr Venkatesh.

[little_willy]

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4343898391323537541&hl=en
:D

Excellent Video!!!! Thanks for sharing it :)

[ebizash]

Excellent video and makes sense to some extent!!

Thanks for sharing

US economy is designed this way, everyone will get their own share. No one bothers about optimizing the chain and reducing the cost. If they do that whole economy will collapse. If people started sticking to one marriage and stop taking the divorces, these lawyers will not have work and that portion of economy will collapse. If you have time please watch this video

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4343898391323537541&hl=en

you will know more about US economy.

:D

[kumar1]

I have seen it happening a lot of times. You would not believe, I have seen management floating dummy projects, just to burn left over money so that they can claim the same amount next year. If they do not burn the cash, it would be hard for management to secure the same amount of budget very next year. You know, Sanju is so true! I have even seen management "encouraging" consultants to do over time. That way, consulting companies get more cash and hiring managers get paid "vacation(s)" somewhere near South Africa or Peru or Rio! Sanju - Well said, felt like something that I have seen at my client's location.

[DallasBlue]

Trust me my friend, I have seen it happen all the time, from large Telecom firm to Govt., its always there, most of the consultants just doesn't come to know about it, but the cut for the managers is there in some form, almost always. Why do each manager has a specific vendor through whom they want to hire most of the time? What else is the reason for the client to pay the consulting company $180/hr but they won't give 'valueablehurdle' anything more than $50-60/hr?

On a different note, now that NSG approved the waiver, most desi uncles, some of them are also owners of desi consulting companies will claim that they are the father of Nuclear deal. These bastards (sorry for my french) always oppose any GC fix and they tell their favorite congressman/senator (each has atleast one favorite politician for whom they do fund raisers) that gc backlog is not an important issue for the community. India Abroad, Times of India, rediff and other desi portals/newspapers will write 'Oliver North' style stories about these desi uncles knowing well that companies like GE etc put their weight behind the deal as it will create commerce to commerce over $20 billion/yr. But desi uncles/orgs will not stop claiming to be the father of nuclear deal. The fact is, most of these desi uncles made noise not because they wanted to do something for their country of birth, they are doing it because they think that if the nuclear deal passes, they can play middle man for US companies to sell the technology/material to Indian companies/govt. Most of the so called 'united voice of Indian-Americans on the Hill' organization's goal is to make big bucks by playing 'middle man' for companies wanting to sell technology to India. And as always, just as 'valuablehurdle''s client (paying $180/hr) Indian govt. will pay double the cost. These desi companies have squeezed blood of people waiting for gc, but now they think its time to move on to play big game with the big boys. These desi uncles/orgs are going nuclear.... time for Rediff and India Abroad to play Oliver North. Sometimes the line between capitalism and cycle of corruption is extremely blur. The problem is, these desi uncles/orgs claim to be representatives of entire Indian-American community, sometimes the entire immigrant community. They don't know more than 100 people, but they claim to be the leaders of all 2.5 million indian americans. Sorry for my french, but these bastards are the owners of desi consulting firms who have done a lot of harm to many communities.

I think IV should compete openly with USINPAC which realistically doesnt have any grassroots support.

http://www.usinpac.com/immigration.asp , guess they amended the last paragraph just this month... and still they dont support/raise the EB based greencard issues...

[newbie2020]

Generally most companies are comfortable doing a 1099 on Corp to Corp than doing a 1099 with an individual. In both cases it is 1099 and company pays $$ as agreed.

There is one major difference why companies want to do business with consulting firms rather than individuals as the perception is when doing business with a firm as opposed to individual you deal with so many people (not just one) who share the responsibilities. If for some reason things don't work with the consultant the company can request the consulting firm to provide substitute so on so forth.

Also firms are perceived financially Strong, can afford $3M+ insurance (just in case something goes wrong) while individual may not be in similar position

it is always better to go with a Consulting firm rather than going individually (Pros certainly outweigh all the cons)

If you have a GC you can incorporate your own company and work ( If you are ready to take additional headache, If not better work for a consulting firm)

[add78]

Nothing is so simple.

Most clients have policies that require them to deal with only a preferred set of vendors. In some cases vendors are managed through a vendor management firm that classifies vendors into 3 categories. The highest level preferred vendors get the most billing rate per resource they provide. In addition, a vendor needs to satisfy a bunch of requirements like % of resources successfully placed vs the number sent for interview with the client, ability to have a certain $ amount of liability and workers comp insurance etc. Due to these factors, a client will not directly enter into a contract with an individual and that individual has to go through a preferred vendor. Now the individual (akak resource) could be tied to a lower level vendor who in turn sends him/her to the preferred vendor who then sends him/her to the client. One of the best ways to increase your hourly rate is to eliminate as many middle tiers as possible. Ideal situation is to work for the preferred vendor that places you onto the client. In most cases of preferred vendors this could only happen if you have a EAD/GC if they do not do H1s. A second best situation is to work for a Desi consultancy that works only with preferred vendors (aka only 1 level between Desi co. and Client). In these cases it might be possible to make almost as much hourly $ rate as you would make working for preferred vendor if say preferred vendor works 80-20 on Corp to Corp but works 70-30 on W2. e.g. Client pays vendor $100/hr, You work directly for Vendor on W-2 and Vendor pays you $70 (70-30 split on W-2). Now if you work for a decent Desi co. that works C2C with this Vendor and if the Vendor pays Desi co $80 (80-20 split on C2C) and Desi co takes out fixed $ (say $8-10) then you still get $70 in hand just like direct W-2 with Vendor. This is if you work on pure $ or % basis with a Big American Preferred Vendor like say Teksystems or TAC worldwide or Ciber or Keane or KForce or Sapphire vs salaried consulting with say Deloitte or Accenture or IBM consulting where the way it works is these big fish do not just provide resources (you) per position like a American Preferred Vendor does but usually take on a big project and then staff resources for completing those projects where they pay you peanuts (like $70-90k) but bill the client like an American Preferred Vendor.

In short, if you are someone who wants job security and doesn't want to look for new contracts on your own and like to travel, stick with Big American Salaried Consulting companies, but if you want to make more money and don't mind a little insecurity/tension/can interview often/ready to move then if on H1, stay with good Desi that works only with Preferred Vendors or if GC/EAD, work on W-2 (as pure $ or % split) with a Big American Vendor.

[FinalGC]

I believe sanju is right to a certain extant. However, I believe it depends upon how much of a close relationship you have established with your clients or per say other clients. Have you done good networking...check out LinkedIn, if not. I can guarantee that if you were to go alone...you could easily ask for at least 110-130/hr, however you may not be able to get the $180/hr, since the companies like IBM, Accenture, Deloitte have an established brand name.

This is something these firms have developed over the years. You will be competing your skills and your relationships versus their combined skillsets and knowledge database, their legal backings, their relationships (not just money) and their history. People are ready to pay for a Cadillac because it is a brand name, while for a Ford they willl not pay that much money.

The key is the relationship and the trust that your client will have with you, rather than your current company....if your company has a bigger and better relationship, you will have a herculean task of removing that and replace that with yours, by proving that you are worth the money. Once you establish the brand name and expertise and the legal backings...you too could get may be $140 or so, but will never be able to reach the $180 level.......This is the industry.

[dba9ioracle]

Do you know many of the deals/contracts are done in a golf course ? That's why your account manager has marketed you with higher rates. Rate is not always based on skill sets.

You should start playing golf and you can market yourself too..

[DDash]

Sanju, add78 and FinalGC and others...great points...Thanks for sharing your thoughts. I am in similar boat as the OP. Its just that I already ventured out and now I am working as an independent contractor. I have a layer to go through between the Client and my employer (Desi).

Big consulting firms could charge 180, 200, even 250 to the client depending on the market rates for the particular skill set. Like most of you all mentioned, they do because like you, they want to make money as well. They have a bigger obligation of making their stakeholders happy. They do lot more than an average independent contractor do. They establish contacts mostly not at the middle manager level, but at the CEO level. As a CEO/CIO of Deloitte/IBM they have better access to CEO/CIO of the client. As it is pretty obvious, CEO/CIOs of the clients actually make/break decisions. So they are generally more successful getting big dollar projects. Once they secure a project, they obviously tend to place their employees on to the projects. Occasionally, they also hire sub-contractors AKA independent consultants when they don’t have enough internal resources.

I am looking for ways to be a successful independent contractor. I believe, networking and building a reliable set of people who can help you is very important. But the challenge is, it is not easy to find people who are reliable and who will ACTUALLY help you land a project. And of course it is not easy to stay in touch with everyone (at least for me).

To OP: I think you will have to decide what you want to do in your career. If company sponsored training, marketing, working on cross platforms/applications, stability, "company name on your resume", etc is important, you will have to compromise on the money. If you want to make quick money, take the plunge and jump in to independent consulting. You can potentially double your salary. You don’t have to have a G.C. to be a independent contractor. G.C./EAD certainly helps but not a requirement.Find a good desi employer who will support you and who will pay you "your share of money", find a good stable project and you are good to go. YOu can save money on taxes as well. But then the downside is, you pay for your own training, traveling and benefits.

End of the day - There are pros and cons on both sides of the world. Pick your choice, you will have to compromise on the cons.

BTW: I have to agree with Sanju on the commissions/under the table transactions that are reality in the consulting world.

[ssdtm]

Most of the time, consultant works at a lower rate because he doesn’t know what is being paid to the vendor. If you know what is being paid to the primary/preferred vendor, and the difference is high, you just pick the phone and have a straight talk. Preferred vendors negotiate. You can squeeze them pretty hard. I had done to $5 margin in the past.
No vendor wants someone to leave a job, tell the client that he is not being paid well because the vendors are keeping a lot of money.

Preferred vendors are now occasionally working on small margins (believe me $10 is VERY good for them, if another middle layer is finding the candidate for them). They take high margin when they when you go by salary and if they think they can find cheaper guys easily.

On the other hand, there are middle layers, who are suckers and will try to keep the high margin. But you can deal very assertively with these middle layers because these are small cos. Never sign non compete with them. You can even chnage them and in fact your final preferred vendors can sometimes do that with you.

with vednros, go hourly instead of salary. I don’t think there is risk, because if you do not have the job at client, you will be fired any way.

With Desi cos holding your H1, I think margin is not the issue. Just have a hourly rate negotiation (no salary negotiation) because in future you can command more rate. If you have EAD, desi co will be willing to work on very small margin because they know you are an unchained tiger now and can run anywhere.

There is a cut for managers, but is not that cut and dry....generally in kind than in cash. Managers favor their favored vendors, but if you are a useful person in team, he will not come in a way. In fact, you can try to use his relationship with the vendor to your advantage. Relationship mgmt is the name of the game (not just plain performance).

If you are billed $180 and paid $85k, here is the strategy:
If I was you, I will set up a conference call with my manager and vendor rep, and tell both that I might leave because vendor is keeping a lions share. Believe me, no vendor and manager would like to have this dialogue in open and your vendor will increase your rate by calling you in advance.

[kopra]

Dear valuablehurdle,
You need to understand why your company is paying only 85K. Your base compensation is 85K, then you have another 10% on top of that as bonus. Also your Health/Dental/vision Insurance will be close to 15K payed by the employer. Also they pay Social Security at 8% base pay + Your H1B and other legal Expense for you and family. This will put your total rewards/compensation well above 100K.
I am not trying to say that your present company is perfect, but these are the common expenses for a company , Thats the reason even if you get hired by the direct client your salary will not increase very much. Companies pay 180$ to the consulting companies for the following reason
1) You are not their employee, so $180 per hour is all they pay ( No benefits, No H1b Legal hassles etc)
2) They Hire consultants for a particular project for a set period of time. After the project is over, they can have the consultant "released" from the project.
3) They dont want to hire independent contractors, cos, if the guy leaves in between the project, its the responsibility of the consulting company to replace your position with another qualified person.In your case, they need to find another candidate with your technical expertise, which is not very easy.Very few Companies wants to take that risk.

You need to look at the total compensation rather than your base pay


It was Hard-Hitting, Sanju !!!
Anyway, I feel there are bad apples......but not all take commissions.

Still, I am at a loss to understand the same company that pays $180 per hour to the American Consulting company will pay me only as much as $50/hr.

What would be their logic?

I would appreciate your replies...

[valuablehurdle]

All arguments are very sensible. No doubt about it. am working on an EAD and they did not incur any legal cost. However, I get frustrated thinking why they charge $180 per hour to the client.... even when the cost to company for me is about $110K per annum or around $60 per hour. I do not know whether I am worth $180 per hour or not....but probably more than $60/hr since they can charge $180 / hr

We really need to analyze this deeply if we want to come up with a strategy....

Thanks for the 3 red dots which I recieved....

[krishna.ahd]

All arguments are very sensible. No doubt about it. am working on an EAD and they did not incur any legal cost. However, I get frustrated thinking why they charge $180 per hour to the client.... even when the cost to company for me is about $110K per annum or around $60 per hour. I do not know whether I am worth $180 per hour or not....but probably more than $60/hr since they can charge $180 / hr

We really need to analyze this deeply if we want to come up with a strategy....

Thanks for the 3 red dots which I recieved....
I guess still do not get the point .
It is not how much they charge for you and how much they pay to you. They ( your compnay) are here for business not for charity.
It is simple economics. Demand and supply.
If you quit they will find zillions of people of same qualification waiting to take the same for $60
Ideally , if you want to find out how much you should get/worth , put yourself in the market and do interview and try to negotiate and see what the range you are being offered . You may not take the offer but at least you will know where you stand.
Be aware full time ( with all benefits) and W2 / C2C/ consulting rate are very diffrerent and another dimension is region for different rate.
Hope this helps.
Wish you Good Luck.