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View Poll Results: Do you want a new Bill that only aims to reduce EB3 and EB2 visa backlog
Yes we want a new Bill 352 95.65%
No new Bill please, its too much work 16 4.35%
Voters: 368. You may not vote on this poll

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  #1 (permalink)  
Old 09-28-2010, 08:17 PM
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Default New or other Piece meal Bills and necessary alternative to CIR

Immigration voice is actively involved in advocacy, campaign efforts in Washington DC.
we need members all over the country to meet or call local Senators and house Reps, about Employment Visa issues regularly and ask them to sponsor, support Bills for our concerns.
This will ensure our voice is heard during meetings of each Chamber - Senate and Congress.
Legal Immigration reform is the core goal of Immigration voice.
This thread will discuss any bill introduced for Legal immigration, including employment and family based.

The advantages being:

1. CIR will not happen for the next 2 years with a republican house majority.
2. This will be a much smaller Bill and a larger percentage of people would support this.
3. We should distinguish ourselves from illegals for a path to the GC
4. We have a big lobby ourselves, with hundreds of thousands pending, to up to 10 million GCs, citizens involved.
5. We deserve preference for following all rules
6. Illegals have a major point lacking - they did not use a H-2A visa and instead broke the law. Due to this there is popular discontent which may doom their legalization, or drag it on for many more years.
7. Legals directly add benefit to the society and tax receipts. Many of us have paid close to 100K in 5 years to IRS. Taxation = fair representation. 5 years = 10 billion from all of us at least, if you assume only 100K immigrants.

Please add points supporting or refuting this.

I have no Ill-will towards illegals, this is just my opinion on what is better for the long term future of this country.
I have the highest compassion for all the poor and needy of the world, but it is irrespective of race, religion, color.

Please support our current effort for pre-filing I-485 http://immigrationvoice.org/forum/fo...ml#post1974292
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Last edited by tonyHK12; 11-04-2010 at 12:29 PM. Reason: Refine statistics
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  #2 (permalink)  
Old 09-28-2010, 08:52 PM
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Default

This won't fly because the simplistic model for immigration bills is -

D(hispanic) + D(labor) + D(neutral) + R(business) + R(nativist) + R(neutral) < Enough votes to pass Congress
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  #3 (permalink)  
Old 09-28-2010, 09:55 PM
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by akred View Post
This won't fly because the simplistic model for immigration bills is -

D(hispanic) + D(labor) + D(neutral) + R(business) + R(nativist) + R(neutral) < Enough votes to pass Congress
I agree, this is the way politics works most of the time. lobby for votes, etc.

But isn't it also their job to do what is in the best interest of the Nation. Everything isn't decided by lobbies.

Maybe we're approaching this the wrong way, in trying to build competing lobby. it needs a new approach. Congress should be convinced in a different way.

Lobby is for optional, nice to have things, which will not be generally missed if they fail.
Legal immigration is none of these and is almost mandatory. Imagine losing for eg. 200K EB3s. another 50K doctors.
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  #4 (permalink)  
Old 09-28-2010, 10:51 PM
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Default they think what what is best for THEIR nation

Quote:
Originally Posted by tonyHK12 View Post
I agree, this is the way politics works most of the time. lobby for votes, etc.

But isn't it also their job to do what is in the best interest of the Nation. Everything isn't decided by lobbies.

Maybe we're approaching this the wrong way, in trying to build competing lobby. it needs a new approach. Congress should be convinced in a different way.

Lobby is for optional, nice to have things, which will not be generally missed if they fail.
Legal immigration is none of these and is almost mandatory. Imagine losing for eg. 200K EB3s. another 50K doctors.
yes, they do think for the betterment of THEIR country. you and i don't fit in THEIR model of GOOD for their country.
your average low information "american" voter lacks the thought capability to process what you are saying.
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  #5 (permalink)  
Old 09-28-2010, 11:56 PM
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by dummgelauft View Post
yes, they do think for the betterment of THEIR country. you and i don't fit in THEIR model of GOOD for their country.
well maybe, but our goals should be to convince a small group of just law makers, who are generally well educated, intelligent.

Last edited by tonyHK12; 09-29-2010 at 08:09 AM.
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  #6 (permalink)  
Old 09-29-2010, 08:35 AM
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by tonyHK12 View Post
well maybe, but our goals should be to convince a small group of just law makers, who are generally well educated, intelligent.
"Well educated and intelligent" - Who? Did you mean Durbin and Grassley?

Yes, I would like to see a new bill for reducing employment based backlog. I don't want to come across as a pessimist.

Last edited by hebron; 09-29-2010 at 08:37 AM.
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  #7 (permalink)  
Old 09-29-2010, 08:55 AM
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by tonyHK12 View Post
I agree, this is the way politics works most of the time. lobby for votes, etc.

But isn't it also their job to do what is in the best interest of the Nation. Everything isn't decided by lobbies.

Maybe we're approaching this the wrong way, in trying to build competing lobby. it needs a new approach. Congress should be convinced in a different way.

Lobby is for optional, nice to have things, which will not be generally missed if they fail.
Legal immigration is none of these and is almost mandatory. Imagine losing for eg. 200K EB3s. another 50K doctors.
Doctors are EB2 and EB1.
They are not EB3

Even Physical therapists are EB2.

EB3 are low level/entry level programmers or skilled workers with with undergraduate degree or diploma degree holders that use education evaluation service to prove that their diploma is equivalent to an undergraduate degree.

Now some of you will say you have masters degree and still are EB3. It does not matter if you have a undergraduate degree from IIT or Harvard and have MBA from Harvard. If your job needs only undergraduate degree your master degrees are useless. You are working in a wrong job and overqualified for your job. You should look for another job that needs your american masters degree. Some will say that their lawyer filed in EB3 even though they qualify for EB2. Now that is also a wrong excuse. If your lawyer and HR screwed you, it is your fault that you could not stand up to them. It is not USCIS fault.

Last edited by eastindia; 09-29-2010 at 08:59 AM.
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  #8 (permalink)  
Old 09-29-2010, 09:43 AM
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Default wow...it is amazing

Even illigal immigrants has more optimism,
And they actually believe themselves they have every right to become a permanant citizens than legal immigrants waiting in line.

Some folks can't even bear the thought if some one thinks they should try to influence the law makers.
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  #9 (permalink)  
Old 09-29-2010, 09:49 AM
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Default illegals and attitude

Quote:
Originally Posted by green_mile View Post
Even illigal immigrants has more optimism,
And they actually believe themselves they have every right to become a permanant citizens than legal immigrants waiting in line.

Some folks can't even bear the thought if some one thinks they should try to influence the law makers.
Illegals have nothing to lose. If CIR happens...they celebrate, now that they can all be legal and apply for their families to follow them
If CIR does not happen...they still continue to live here, work their jobs, keep sending money home, and try and get their relatives over here by paying the "coyotes"...it makes no difference to them.

Even if these guys are legalised, they will still NOT pay taxes, NOT learn english, NOT try and be upstanding residents.

They have huge numers, both in population and political support.

They represent a MASSIVE democratic vote bank.

WE (EB) have none of the above and a lot to lose)

Hence, the attitude.
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  #10 (permalink)  
Old 09-29-2010, 09:51 AM
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Default Try this

Quote:
Originally Posted by tonyHK12 View Post
well maybe, but our goals should be to convince a small group of just law makers, who are generally well educated, intelligent.
Try writing about supporting legislative relief for EB community, to your local congress man/woman.
After that post the reply that yuo get from them, on this forum.

your doubts will be cleared.
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  #11 (permalink)  
Old 09-29-2010, 10:36 AM
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by dummgelauft View Post
Illegals have nothing to lose. If CIR happens...they celebrate, now that they can all be legal and apply for their families to follow them
If CIR does not happen...they still continue to live here, work their jobs, keep sending money home, and try and get their relatives over here by paying the "coyotes"...it makes no difference to them.

Even if these guys are legalised, they will still NOT pay taxes, NOT learn english, NOT try and be upstanding residents.

WE (EB) have none of the above and a lot to lose)

Hence, the attitude.
This is a great point. Also I see these days, people seem to miss what is 'Right' and 'Wrong', 'Fair' and 'Unfair'. Doesn't seem to matter much anymore - let Inertia rule.

"Even illigal immigrants has more optimism"
They succesfully broke the law and think they are above most laws now

"If your lawyer and HR screwed you, it is your fault"
Yes apparently this is happening for more than 100K EB3s. Bonded labor? well don't trash EB3s - you have to be very good to get an American company to file an EB green card.

"Well educated and intelligent - Who? Did you mean Durbin and Grassley?"
Well, Lets be diplomatic :-)

Also I'm curious, why would someone give me Neg reps, are illegals lurking on these boards?

Last edited by tonyHK12; 11-01-2010 at 07:43 PM.
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  #12 (permalink)  
Old 09-29-2010, 10:47 AM
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Default

...and what's the point of this discussion here? The point is not lost on anyone here that such bill(s) are needed and passed. So I am not quite sure what you hope to achieve by this poll - will this lead to any action on your part to write up such a bill or talk to your congressmen/women about the points discussed here?

I think a lot of people here just like to discuss the hell out of this topic just make themselves feel better!
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  #13 (permalink)  
Old 09-29-2010, 10:59 AM
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sdeshpan View Post
...and what's the point of this discussion here? The point is not lost on anyone here that such bill(s) are needed and passed.

I think a lot of people here just like to discuss the hell out of this topic just make themselves feel better!
The point is to get a Bill created eventually and have a campaign. We have to start somewhere. Also I would like to have a centralized point for discussing and acting on, just reform for Legal immigrants, mostly employment based, but it can evolve into other eventually, student, family...

Last edited by tonyHK12; 11-01-2010 at 07:46 PM.
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  #14 (permalink)  
Old 09-29-2010, 11:32 AM
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Default Atleast someone is thinking differently

Every time someone comes up with something new they get shot down here by "certain" other members. They try to find reasons to say it was a bad idea rather than saying something constructive. Give this guy a chance.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sdeshpan View Post
...and what's the point of this discussion here? The point is not lost on anyone here that such bill(s) are needed and passed. So I am not quite sure what you hope to achieve by this poll - will this lead to any action on your part to write up such a bill or talk to your congressmen/women about the points discussed here?

I think a lot of people here just like to discuss the hell out of this topic just make themselves feel better!
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  #15 (permalink)  
Old 09-29-2010, 11:40 AM
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by tonyHK12 View Post
The point is to get a Bill created eventually and have a campaign. We have to start somewhere.
You are talking about bringing a bill:

How many congressman and Senators have you met till now ?

You want to bring a bill without lobbying. So tell your plans. Let us all see.

You created your new ID, started a thread and you think that is a good start. I need to see something real in an idea than believing in your idea.
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