HR 3012 general discussion since April 2012

[django1]

Think for yourself - where have you seen these measures ever work, except with Sanjay dutt in a movie? Even sanju baba used an AK-52 in real life Gandhi had a definite gameplan during non-copoperation movement which ultimately bore fruit - that was that millions of indians not-working(non-cooperating) and not paying (salt) tax puts too much pressure on the finances of a war-ravaged empire to be able to possibly continue to exist, and that is what ultimately happened. can you think of some similarly brilliant idea?

Originally Posted by RohitSharma

The whole EB community is a fattu lot, we kept thinking if we'll do this hathoda will hit our foot, in the meantime, Grasseley hit it on our head

[pappu]

It is good to see members getting desperate. Let it grow more . And more people need to get desperate instead of few. It is not the time for giving new ideas. That time is long gone. And if there is a desire to do real action, those folks are 1 year late. If you remember we were doing full scale public advocacy work on this bill. We posted on the forums, sent many newsletters and made many phone calls to people urging them to come to DC for our meetings. I remember myself making at least 250 phone calls to members asking to come. Other volunteers too spent nights and weekends calling every person on IV and urging them to come. Why were we even doing that? Should people not come themselves ? They were not doing a favor to IV by coming but a favor to themselves. Some even had the audacity to tell IV that they will come only if IV pays for their travel, stay and food and they will come. And one guy wanted to come with family do meeting and also sightseeing on IV. We refused. We can also see the who is making noise on the forum and how much they have contributed and if they are contributing now. Many do not even have their name and phone number or even correct name and phone number and email address in profile. We wasted so much time calling fake numbers. At this time if there is anything this community can do is support IV and we as a team are committed to working on it. It is not the time to throw new ideas at everyone and expecting IV core to work on them. Even people who give ideas will not work on their ideas once they have to do real work and spend their own time and effort implementing it. They will give all kinds of excuses to wiggle out. And ultimately it becomes IV Cortez's duty to implement what someone ele started. If there is going to be an action item for public, it will be posted for public. We are proud of our dedicated group of volunteers which have been active for a long time and working day and night and weekends with us to solve the problem. It is time to show sincerity and not to show ideas. The desperation needs to increase in each one of us and greencard wait become nightmare for people to realize they need to act. Without this desperation people will only come to forums for entertainment, waste time tracking and predicting, pick a fight or criticize others.

[happyfeet]

I saw this in this thread..

''We need a loud voice to get through those deaf ears''

Two suggestions.. could be too foolish

RING THE BELL-- Organize to do pooja to get GC in temple, church ...on a particular date with publicity

Send cards/letters to senators to reach before July 4th asking for independence (GC), as we are all in Bonded Employment (EB)

[turvi76]

Originally Posted by happyfeet

I saw this in this thread..

''We need a loud voice to get through those deaf ears''

Two suggestions.. could be too foolish

RING THE BELL-- Organize to do pooja to get GC in temple, church ...on a particular date with publicity

Send cards/letters to senators to reach before July 4th asking for independence (GC), as we are all in Bonded Employment (EB)

i like your idea of taking this opportunity of "independence day" to emphasize our cause of freedom from this wait. you are so correct and how it ties us down in more than many ways...job, family, entrepreneurship, travel, etc...
lets us also not forget that people will be too consumed in celebrating their long weekends and travelling.

[cmanoj2000]

Pappu

Thanks for your and IV's efforts which have culminated in bring HR 3012 so far. It is very very hard to move things politically and it is a great achievement by IV to see a bill passed by house with more than 80% support.

As you said correctly, getting traction on these things does require hard-work and only discussing things on the forum would not get us much far.

With this large scale effort (on HR 3012), am sure a majority of the lawmakers are aware of the issues involved. However, sometime I wonder if more should and/or can be done to educate the general public about this issue. Most people, and even journalists, are not aware of differences between someone just on H1B (or other kind of temporary visas) and someone in the GC queue looking to become part of America.

Can something be done to bring out the human tragedy in this long drawn immigration process for Indians and Chinese? The loss of productive years, wasted human capital and postponed investments in business/homes costing the economy.

Is there a way to bring out our message in a balanced and non-emotional way for average voter to understand? I think bringing out this message in any form on radio(NPR, others)/tv stations, etc. would give the issue more widespread support. Imagine if David Brooks (NYT) or Peggy Noonan (WSJ) talk even a little bit about this issue, what kind of coverage and reaction it can generate.

Recently WSJ had a great story on asian immigrants - I think a good reply published in "Letters to the editor" highlighting the issues would be positive for the overall IV effort.

What are IV's thoughts on this softer approach as a parallel track?

[immigrant2007]

Originally Posted by turvi76

i like your idea of taking this opportunity of "independence day" to emphasize our cause of freedom from this wait. you are so correct and how it ties us down in more than many ways...job, family, entrepreneurship, travel, etc...
lets us also not forget that people will be too consumed in celebrating their long weekends and travelling.

I dount anything is going t happen. We even dont know from which quota these DREAMERS will gt thier numbers from? how will they be adjudicated? Though I feel for them (being in an unkown status for years ) but not too positive abuot the system which is not very open. WE cant follow up of Lobor cant get true status of our applications cant speak to case officers for such and such reasons all this just because we follow the rules so its our destiny to be treated like trash every time. Sorry guys for being too negative but hoping for anything here in this country for us is impossible.

[h1techSlave]

By failing to act now, IV is essentially "Grabbing defeat from the jaws of victory".

Obama has done the unconstitutional move of thwarting the decision of the elected representatives of the American people by giving amnesty to the illegals. Unfortunately this is a very popular move and is very widely praised by the elites in this country, simply because none of the amnestied illegal is going to take the job of those elites (including us).

Now, the Republican party needs some kind of a popular move to show the country that they are also progressive, they are also pro-human being etc. At this time, we can give them this golden opportunity. If HR3012 were to pass, that move can be very effectively be claimed by the Republican party to prove to the American people that the Republican party is also pro-immigration, pro-economic growth, pro-American dream.

But IV has taken the decision to do nothing; essentially "grabbing defeat from the jaws of victory".

[amulchandra]

Originally Posted by h1techSlave

By failing to act now, IV is essentially "Grabbing defeat from the jaws of victory".

Obama has done the unconstitutional move of thwarting the decision of the elected representatives of the American people by giving amnesty to the illegals. Unfortunately this is a very popular move and is very widely praised by the elites in this country, simply because none of the amnestied illegal is going to take the job of those elites (including us).

Now, the Republican party needs some kind of a popular move to show the country that they are also progressive, they are also pro-human being etc. At this time, we can give them this golden opportunity. If HR3012 were to pass, that move can be very effectively be claimed by the Republican party to prove to the American people that the Republican party is also pro-immigration, pro-economic growth, pro-American dream.

But IV has taken the decision to do nothing; essentially "grabbing defeat from the jaws of victory".

Hold on. Will any person/organization stop swimming the current when the banks are so close. Trust them. Definitely there is a reason behind this calm and quietness.

[bigboy007]

Its easy to say than do. IV means you. What have you done to make IV not accept defeat , even though i dont see that way ?

Originally Posted by h1techSlave

By failing to act now, IV is essentially "Grabbing defeat from the jaws of victory".

Obama has done the unconstitutional move of thwarting the decision of the elected representatives of the American people by giving amnesty to the illegals. Unfortunately this is a very popular move and is very widely praised by the elites in this country, simply because none of the amnestied illegal is going to take the job of those elites (including us).

Now, the Republican party needs some kind of a popular move to show the country that they are also progressive, they are also pro-human being etc. At this time, we can give them this golden opportunity. If HR3012 were to pass, that move can be very effectively be claimed by the Republican party to prove to the American people that the Republican party is also pro-immigration, pro-economic growth, pro-American dream.

But IV has taken the decision to do nothing; essentially "grabbing defeat from the jaws of victory".

[h1techSlave]

Originally Posted by amulchandra

Hold on. Will any person/organization stop swimming the current when the banks are so close. Trust them. Definitely there is a reason behind this calm and quietness.

The problem amulchandra is that it is human nature to 'Trust' the leader (in this case IV). And any one who brings a new idea to the table is automatically assumed to have only bad things in mind as far as the overall goals of the organization. We (including the organization's leaders themselves) assume that the guys in the top can not make mistakes. They are also human; and human beings often make mistakes. And some times they do "stop swimming the current when the banks are so close."

[h1techSlave]

Originally Posted by bigboy007

Its easy to say than do. IV means you. What have you done to make IV not accept defeat , even though i dont see that way ?

"Its easy to say than do." - Sure it is. But first we have to say it aloud and come to a consensus. And then we do the action based on the consuses opinion, right?

"IV means you." - IV included me. I did not say other wise, did I?

"What have you done.." - My question would be: What can I do? Do you have any ideas?

[Robert Kumar]

Originally Posted by h1techSlave

"Its easy to say than do." - Sure it is. But first we have to say it aloud and come to a consensus. And then we do the action based on the consuses opinion, right?

"IV means you." - IV included me. I did not say other wise, did I?

"What have you done.." - My question would be: What can I do? Do you have any ideas?

The reason with most us getting impatient is the HUGE success we saw that IV did for us. We all have seen how the floor mentioned IV when passing in the house. That raises a LOTs of hopes. And when the Senate is open from last week of Jan, we're all expecting quick action. And now come elections in 4-5 months. So we all feel time is running out very fast, as we dont expect too much action related to these as time passes. Nothing visible happened so far related to this in Senate. Hence we all feel if there is something we can do. And when DREAM passes in one form, that adds more salt to the wound as we feel we're more eligible for that kind of action, being legal.

[GCHope2011]

Originally Posted by h1techSlave

By failing to act now, IV is essentially "Grabbing defeat from the jaws of victory".

Obama has done the unconstitutional move of thwarting the decision of the elected representatives of the American people by giving amnesty to the illegals. Unfortunately this is a very popular move and is very widely praised by the elites in this country, simply because none of the amnestied illegal is going to take the job of those elites (including us).

Now, the Republican party needs some kind of a popular move to show the country that they are also progressive, they are also pro-human being etc. At this time, we can give them this golden opportunity. If HR3012 were to pass, that move can be very effectively be claimed by the Republican party to prove to the American people that the Republican party is also pro-immigration, pro-economic growth, pro-American dream.

But IV has taken the decision to do nothing; essentially "grabbing defeat from the jaws of victory".

"Now, the Republican party needs some kind of a popular move to show the country that they are also progressive, they are also pro-human being etc. At this time, we can give them this golden opportunity. "

And how exactly do you think "we" can give "them" this opportunity? Are "we" the ones who have been stopping "them" (or anyone)?

It is ok to be naive, but it does not help blaming IV based on that naivety..

[waitingnwaiting]

Originally Posted by GCHope2011

"Now, the Republican party needs some kind of a popular move to show the country that they are also progressive, they are also pro-human being etc. At this time, we can give them this golden opportunity. "

And how exactly do you think "we" can give "them" this opportunity? Are "we" the ones who have been stopping "them" (or anyone)?

It is ok to be naive, but it does not help blaming IV based on that naivety..

Very good reply.

It's easy to say and point fingers. Let these people define 'we' ' them' ' opportunity' and 'how'.

[immigrant2007]

Originally Posted by h1techSlave

By failing to act now, IV is essentially "Grabbing defeat from the jaws of victory".

Obama has done the unconstitutional move of thwarting the decision of the elected representatives of the American people by giving amnesty to the illegals. Unfortunately this is a very popular move and is very widely praised by the elites in this country, simply because none of the amnestied illegal is going to take the job of those elites (including us).

Now, the Republican party needs some kind of a popular move to show the country that they are also progressive, they are also pro-human being etc. At this time, we can give them this golden opportunity. If HR3012 were to pass, that move can be very effectively be claimed by the Republican party to prove to the American people that the Republican party is also pro-immigration, pro-economic growth, pro-American dream.

But IV has taken the decision to do nothing; essentially "grabbing defeat from the jaws of victory".

I don't agree with you that IV is the culprit here. I do not think IV is responsibile for our no improvement in our situation. We ourselves are responsible atleast IV tried to do something but we backloggers prefer going to temple , weekend parties, birthdays and other meaningless stuff but don;t fight for our cause. We SANTCHED the defeat from a certain victory which was made possible by a select few in IV and its supporters. Remeber a team is as good as its players and a Captian as good as its team. Here our Captain IV was far better then us (all backloggers). It showed us a path but we did not want to take it. If all 40000 - 80000 backloggers combine and concentrate their efforts then this dream can be realized otherwise forget it. Each one of us has to somehow concivnce all our coworkers to participate actively as if our life hangs by it. Otherwise forget it (that's why I said in my earlier post That I doubt anything god will happen for us). If we do so then we can criticize IV till then I dont think we have the right to criticize IV.