What does emmigration from India mean to you?

[psagarn]

Just pondering over what I have achieved by leaving India, my ancestors land, and settling in USA. Here are a few:

• A great job where I don't have to work 12-15 hrs a day and where I do not have working weekends.
• Liberty to live a life almost free of corruption, where I do not have to fear a traffic cop just because I am riding a motorcycle.
• Access to great infrastructure where an hour of rain does not result in 5 hrs of traffic jam, where I get unlimited supply of electricity even in summer, where the taps run whole day.
• And many more such visible and obvious benefits that I experience in my daily life here in America.

But thinking about what I left behind:

• Evolutionary advantage that my ancestors and I had that was accrued during last, god knows how many centuries. My genes are native to Indian land and environment, and so are tuned to react in a better manner than if they were in an alien land, like America. I have given away something that might take 1000s of years to regain, and the worst part is that I took a decision not only for myself but also for my future generations. Will I and my future generations have to undergo the same evolution that my ancestors underwent over 1000s of years, back in India?
  
• The culture that evolved over 1000s of years. All the festivals ...small pieces of wisdom like benefits of Tulsi, Turmeric, Jai-fal etc. .... things that we do back in India like a new Mom and her baby must not venture out for first 40 days. These are some of the non-trivial insights that our ancestors gained after careful observation over 100s of generations. Please do not dismiss these insights as superstitions just because we do not know the reason (or we lost the reason in between the generations of following them). Not only I am going to lose these traditions but I will also make my kids lose them too. Western civilization deeply believes in modern day medical science for which we often see commercials from attorneys offering assistance in claiming compensation against side effects of "wonder drugs". Frankly, I am not sure if modern medical science is a bane or boon but what I am sure about is that Indian wisdom regarding nature based medicines is not a bane.
• Social practices that we have in India and the indirectly resulting values from them.
  

I am unable to decide what is best for me and my kids, staying here in America or going back to where my roots are. Thoughts?

[go_guy123]

Posting garbage on IV....

[Green_Always]

It all depends on your requirements and your choices !!

everyone has there own needs and adopt to circumstances as they go along.

There is no correct answer to your question, you will know the correct answer based on your needs and thinking, and many other factors relating to you specifically.

there are people staying here from past 50 years and some gone back after 5 years, they had there own needs and priorites.

[psagarn]

Originally Posted by go_guy123

Posting garbage on IV....

Appreciate your thoughtful response and all the time that you spent in coming up with these kind words.

[InTheMoment]

Wonderful post psagarn. I loved your thoughtfulness or should I say awareness about the intricacies of the of the age old intelligent and enlightened practices and their value.

Only a few have the keenness to discern these.

Those who think your thoughts are garbage either don't have the patience to read thro' the whole post or have lost their grey cells to assimilate finer thoughts. Let them reel in their comfort zone!!

But yes... please do post things in the right forum in IV.

[immigrant2007]

Originally Posted by psagarn

Just pondering over what I have achieved by leaving India, my ancestors land, and settling in USA. Here are a few:

• A great job where I don't have to work 12-15 hrs a day and where I do not have working weekends.
• Liberty to live a life almost free of corruption, where I do not have to fear a traffic cop just because I am riding a motorcycle.
• Access to great infrastructure where an hour of rain does not result in 5 hrs of traffic jam, where I get unlimited supply of electricity even in summer, where the taps run whole day.
• And many more such visible and obvious benefits that I experience in my daily life here in America.

But thinking about what I left behind:

• Evolutionary advantage that my ancestors and I had that was accrued during last, god knows how many centuries. My genes are native to Indian land and environment, and so are tuned to react in a better manner than if they were in an alien land, like America. I have given away something that might take 1000s of years to regain, and the worst part is that I took a decision not only for myself but also for my future generations. Will I and my future generations have to undergo the same evolution that my ancestors underwent over 1000s of years, back in India?
  
• The culture that evolved over 1000s of years. All the festivals ...small pieces of wisdom like benefits of Tulsi, Turmeric, Jai-fal etc. .... things that we do back in India like a new Mom and her baby must not venture out for first 40 days. These are some of the non-trivial insights that our ancestors gained after careful observation over 100s of generations. Please do not dismiss these insights as superstitions just because we do not know the reason (or we lost the reason in between the generations of following them). Not only I am going to lose these traditions but I will also make my kids lose them too. Western civilization deeply believes in modern day medical science for which we often see commercials from attorneys offering assistance in claiming compensation against side effects of "wonder drugs". Frankly, I am not sure if modern medical science is a bane or boon but what I am sure about is that Indian wisdom regarding nature based medicines is not a bane.
• Social practices that we have in India and the indirectly resulting values from them.
  

I am unable to decide what is best for me and my kids, staying here in America or going back to where my roots are. Thoughts?

Sir decisions to settle are never to be taken in haste or wihtout thinking through, sometimes we are pre occuppied by one thought process that we are not able to think about the negatives of it of positives or the other one. Sometimes we lrean by experience, or may be it could be case of un fullfilled ambition or just pure luck. Every place has some good points about it. For genes I don;'t agree on becuase change is permanent everything else in temporary (even genes need change at some or many levels :-) )

[permfiling]

Infact good thing you had brought this up as we here in US had just seen the tip of the iceberg which is recession, we have seen occasional racial tensions (hooded kid killed), we are seeing desi couples with kids getting divorced...it was always the race which wins, now in modern day ...earlier it used to be english , french and other Europeans expanding kingdoms. Now it is the raj of the country with intellectual,nuclear power. There is a good documentary by Moore on gun control and what do americans fear off and own guns. In the US, ppl don't have the same level of faith we have in india. For example, would you live in a predominately mexican/aferican american neighboorhoods ? Number of disturbed / physic cases are on the raise such as pedophiles, mass killings of people etc....

I think this is a very good topic to debate about as we are laying the ground for future generations of indians...

[psagarn]

Originally Posted by InTheMoment

Wonderful post psagarn. I loved your thoughtfulness or should I say awareness about the intricacies of the of the age old intelligent and enlightened practices and their value.

Only a few have the keenness to discern these.

Those who think your thoughts are garbage either don't have the patience to read thro' the whole post or have lost their grey cells to assimilate finer thoughts. Let them reel in their comfort zone!!

But yes... please do post things in the right forum in IV.

Glad to see some support, I can probably say now that I am not paranoid. As for posting in the right forum, I thought I posted it under "Analysis Discussion", not sure how it landed under "Analysis Discussion > Retrogression, priority dates and Visa bulletins". Sorry about that. Not sure how to move it now, can any one do the needful, or let me know how to do it?

[psagarn]

Originally Posted by immigrant2007

Sir decisions to settle are never to be taken in haste or wihtout thinking through, sometimes we are pre occuppied by one thought process that we are not able to think about the negatives of it of positives or the other one. Sometimes we lrean by experience, or may be it could be case of un fullfilled ambition or just pure luck. Every place has some good points about it. For genes I don;'t agree on becuase change is permanent everything else in temporary (even genes need change at some or many levels :-) )

Agree with most of what you wrote. Additionally, we can only think about what we know and as you would agree we grow wiser with the time...as each day teaches us new things. So, what we know today is far more than what we knew a few years ago, hence the need to revisit the decisions taken in the past. As for the change, it has a cost associated with it. When we switch/change the industry/profession that we work in, we pay in terms of time that we have to spend learning the tricks of the new trade. I am sure my future generations would be able to survive this new environment just as Europeans survived, the question is, Is it worth paying the cost?

[sac-r-ten]

is such that, we are never satisfied with what we have. My friends in India are desperate to leave the country and settle anywhere on this earth. we here after jumping into the GC race trying to think about life in India/Indian values.
Don't get me wrong @psagarn, your thoughts are absolutely what they should be for a person whose left india many years ago, but as i said people are fed up in india and i have met people who had gone back and return to US as they found it v v difficult to adjust.

So wherever you are, you were destined to be there. Remember HE makes plans, not us.

good luck.

[pillagandhi]

we are 1.3 billion people packed into a fertile land and we keep growing. Our country has enough faultlines through religion.caste.region,language etc to begin with. Clean water and power to all the citizens of india is still a mirage.As country moves from a low consumption to high consumption society, resource limitation will qucikly come into play.

states will start fighting with each other
regions within the state will start fighting with each other

For the richie rich US or India it does not matter it is equally good
For the poorest of the poor Us or India it does not matter it is equally bad

It is the middle/uppermiddle who can make a big change in their quality of life by moving from india to US. But even this is closing with the greencard mess.

We all move for upward mobility (Not necessarily financial) and pay a price for it (Retrogression/lost careers).We can only hope that our offsprings will have a better life.

This is the story of any ANIMAL on ANIMAL PLANET

[gk_2000]

Most of you guys seem to be still inside their egg-shells.

And talking of changing your genes hints of admiration of white man. Have some self-respect. Moreover, this is NOT what America is about. America is about diversity, and we desis are free to follow all aspects of our culture here. It is your naive viewpoint that is to blame

Your other points -- great job etc -- are also your own: it is worthwhile to remember. America is different to different people. But there are lots of other philosophies that you are unaware of. There is a long story/history behind every concept that you see here. For example, gun laws. Do you know that people equate gun ownership as the guarantee of freedom and liberty? To understand better, take Syria as an example -- if people owned guns, they could fight better to liberate their country from dictator. Also, it would preempt any politician from trying any funny business

What I am saying is, you have a lens stitched to your eyebrow by being in India too long. If you want to truly understand this country you must mingle with the American people -- blacks, whites, browns -- everyone. Only then you can properly relate

[thomachan72]

Most of the things you are saying you or your future generation will loose or miss after having settled here in the US are already being lost even by those staying in India my friend. Go to the schools/colleges these days and mingle with the youth in India. You will see no trace of the so called 1000 years of evolution (except for the remants of caste system). Some might not even know what turmeric is let alone its medicinal properties. So maintaining your roots and your culture/identity is not linked to where you live rather than how you decide to conduct your life. You can maintain all your evolutionary characteristics (good ones ofcourse not the terrible things like caste system/dowry/sati etc etc) while asmiliating into the western culture thereby helping refine the culture here and that is all about the improvment of the whole world. Bring the good and take the good from here to make a better you.

[deepakd]

wonderful thread...

[psagarn]

Originally Posted by gk_2000

Most of you guys seem to be still inside their egg-shells.

And talking of changing your genes hints of admiration of white man. Have some self-respect. Moreover, this is NOT what America is about. America is about diversity, and we desis are free to follow all aspects of our culture here. It is your naive viewpoint that is to blame

Your other points -- great job etc -- are also your own: it is worthwhile to remember. America is different to different people. But there are lots of other philosophies that you are unaware of. There is a long story/history behind every concept that you see here. For example, gun laws. Do you know that people equate gun ownership as the guarantee of freedom and liberty? To understand better, take Syria as an example -- if people owned guns, they could fight better to liberate their country from dictator. Also, it would preempt any politician from trying any funny business

What I am saying is, you have a lens stitched to your eyebrow by being in India too long. If you want to truly understand this country you must mingle with the American people -- blacks, whites, browns -- everyone. Only then you can properly relate

Whose egg shell are you talking about or is it just a typo and you meant "your".
Changing the genes...who is changing them? May be you are getting confused between Genes and Jeans. You don't change the former, they get altered/evolved/mutated on their own and you don't have much control over them...that is how survival of the fittest works. Where as the latter one can be changed by paying a visit to a tailor.
Also, re: admiration of white man and having some self respect, I am not sure what made you make that comment. Why would you think that people here on this thread do not have self respect. May be it is because you are confusing Genes with Jeans.

Your statement about America having different meanings to different people does make sense though. For those escaping from religious persecution, it means religious freedom...for those facing genocide in their native country it means a chance to survive....and for a lot Indians, it means a better standard of living...you are right but most of us know that..there is nothing new in your statement. But how is the second amendment relevant to this discussion, I fail to understand.

Frankly, a big part of your message is incoherent and thus confusing...I am not even sure who are you talking about when you say "You". Is it people who have a doubt about long term, across generations, benefits of leaving their ancestors land or those that belong to the other side. Please clarify.