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  #16 (permalink)  
Old 11-05-2009, 04:27 PM
ita ita is offline
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Don't worry, with Westerners,half Westerners ruling India there's no way India will join the developed nations club.
During the national election in India I did post the piece about how Saino had appointed this group of junkies to lobby with United Nation to take up caste system in India as human rights violation.Seems like the effort was successful.It's a ploy to checkmate India if it ever gets to the point of joining the developed nations club.

Asia Times Online :: South Asia news, business and economy from India and Pakistan

Needless to say the hue and cry in India against this UN's decision is just hog wash and this TOI article could just be a subtle attempt to add credence to UN decision if one goes by the timing.

Vedas,Avataras,Enlightened masters, Indian political reformers,common people (like me) have always condemned untouchability. Don't know how you and people like you miss this simple fact about Vedas.Is it half knowledge or are you part of the camp that thinks the only way to shine is by slinging mud on anything that you envisage as threat to your vested interests?

What is actually left of the practice in India is just like what is left of other evil practices in developed countries.What is depicted by the media about untouchability is unlike what is depicted by the same media about other evils practices prevalent in developed nations.In just that context alone India gets special treatment and the reason for it is anybody's guess.

It's another thing that Indian govt practices caste system in the name of reservations.

AFAIK This thread is not about about your views of Vedas or about where India needs development although you are welcome to have your views.
It's about the quality of life on day-day basis despite westerners ruling the country,despite the caste,religious discrimination encouraged by the govt.




Quote:
Originally Posted by narendra_modi View Post
don't shower me the red guys..I just put one of my view ..where India needs developement, other than economical..I have travelled all over India especially villages in North and West..and its a fact ..that we still..you know ..I don't want to write ..but people knows what I am trying to ..and the article published is just a village ..there are thousands such...Isn't it a frustrating/disturbing/embarassing on part of India, especially when India is about to join the club of developed nation ?

Last edited by ita; 11-05-2009 at 04:30 PM.
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  #17 (permalink)  
Old 11-05-2009, 04:35 PM
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You got a problem ?, whatever you try/do/will do will not make a iota of difference in India'a Rise


Quote:
Originally Posted by narendra_modi View Post
Dalits enter TN temple first time in 100 yrs - India - The Times of India

Indians still inherit from Vedas....thats the fact....
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  #18 (permalink)  
Old 11-05-2009, 07:03 PM
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Default wish we can get rid of corrupt politicians

Every time I want to believe in the fact that India is developing, some news shakes me and tells me to be real.
The latest episode is of Mr Madhu Koda, the ex CM of Jharkhand who has made a illegal property of Rs4000 crore during his tenure as CM.
I have no hope of india's development if every other politician is sucking blood of India this way.
Recently Rahul Gandhi was heard mentioning that out of every Rs 1 sent for development only 10 paise reaches to the root level.
It will be foolish to assume "Real" development in these circumstances.
I do want to see India as a developed nation, but I don't see it happening.
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  #19 (permalink)  
Old 11-05-2009, 08:59 PM
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USDream2Dust will become famous soon enough
Talking Don't kill the messenger

I am indian by heart and very grateful to what the country has given me.

Following things are great and very helpful in life that only india or other developing nation can teach you.

1. Value of Money
2. Value of Life
3. Value of Education
4. Value of Struggle in life.

BUT

India doesn't provide either of that. So when you have learned the above in India Move to a developed nation and you would be just fine.

Big Malls and High Salaries and multi crore flyover projects in india is nothing that excites me since that is all inflation and Rich keeps on getting richer, corrupt keeps on getting corrupter(don't know if that is even a word) and Population keeps on exploding in limited resource. If you are middle class in india and many of us are, It is better to be a middle class in Developed nation like US. Since Life is easy and you already know 4 above values.

I still wonder how people in big cities of india even think that wearing gap shirts and driving a camry is rich and they don't need to struggle in US. Also people think life quality is better in india. Its a false feeling, and thinking that you can now buy (if you got money)a BMW and porshe in india, there is no need of getting to developed nations.

Now kids born in US don't value any of the above four and have different issues. So while moving from developing nation to a developed nation is a boon to parents it may work other way round for the kids raised in developed nation.
But looking at current generation kids in big cities in India, I doubt that the false feeling of accomplishments of the nation is driving the ignorant kids in wrong direction there too. They think that with less effort and struggle they can get everything.

So bottom line is very simple like 1+1=2

If you got lots of money and great family stay in india.
If you are a working middle class or even just working and who thinks that you are getting richer day by day and you have goal of becoming rich, Please donot try this in your home land. Move out.

while there are exceptions, you are not one if you are reading this post

I think I revealed my secret knowledge of 30 years since my birth

Don't argue with me of bright prospects in india if you don't drive a Lexus or Porsche in India. If you drive that in India, Donot argue as you were excluded from my remarks.

Thanks,

USDream2Dust
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  #20 (permalink)  
Old 11-05-2009, 09:17 PM
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Default I see Degradation day by day No signs of Development

I am in US for 10 yr and visited India twice, lastly in 2007. I visit Gujarat, which is belived to be one of the most developed part, bombay and Delhi all these times.

I had never seen any signs of developments except for there are few malls where peoples go to hang around (not to purchase as it is mostly out of reach of most of the peoples)

In gujarat after building express Hwy 10 yr back no major infrastructures except few minor roads in city to take care of increasing population.

The Education system has gone from Bad to WORST with every one can claim that he is engineer most of them just pay fees to get entitled for that claim.

Health facilities are sophisticated in instruments but has gone WORST even in PRIVATE hospitals in terms of TREATING and CARING for Patients.

No one can afford the home, for their growing kids. Some belive that it is easy to send kid to USA then to buy home in India for their son.

Most of the people take wrong pride in their real estate value which rise by LACS every month and year. I dont know how with local income some one can purchase those when we can not with US income.

Quality of life is detoriating.You can not TRUST ANY ONE of WHAT HE/SHE is SPEAKING even if they give you in WRITING. INCLUDING YOUR RELATIVES. SO people to people relations are becoming artificial and for selfish motives in India. In US atleast you can trust what is being said and written. Indian Social life and warmth behind old relationship you can not experience any more.

We can not even mention the problems of population growth, polution, corruption etc. which even no one there care for including goverment.

Just having high pay in few IT jobs and Having artificial rise of SHARE AND STOCKS and REAL ESTATES OVER NIGHTS are not the right parameters for development.

I think 10% peoples in India are getting RICH every minute, 30% in MIDDLE/HIGHER MIDDLE Classs are maintiating or Dragging behind with all artificaul money like (US earlier or in California) and rest 60-70% are increasingly becoming poor with each day and month to pass.

I would love to see India developed in EDUCATION ( not number of DEGREES, I have seen so many reports that Reliance Infosis etc complaint for lack of enough good people available to work for them) Health care, population, polution control, Infrastrusture, corrouption and on TOP OF THAT MORALITY OF ALL THE PEOPLES THERE.

I have hard time even in DREAM to BELIVE THAT INDIA is DEVELOPING. I can belive that INDIA is GROWING

No govt can develop the nation, India will never develop to the extent of the Developed nation untill people there develop high moral and work standards that we see all around world. I dont think there is a short cut to sucess. We had just started our growth. Now we have to KNOW OUR PROBLEMS currently WE ARE JUST IGNORING ALL THE PROBLEMS and GETTING WRONG SATISFACTION AND SELF ESTEEM IN our TEMPORARY ARTIFICIAL GROWTH LIKE that of STOCK MARKET. WE NEED TO BUILD ON FUNDAMENTALS for GOOD QUALITY LIFE TO SUCCEED AND DEVELOP.
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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 11-05-2009, 09:30 PM
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perfect analysis pmpForGC !!!
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  #22 (permalink)  
Old 11-05-2009, 09:31 PM
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USDream2Dust will become famous soon enough
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pmpforgc View Post
I think 10% peoples in India are getting RICH every minute, 30% in MIDDLE/HIGHER MIDDLE Classs are maintiating or Dragging behind with all artificaul money like (US earlier or in California) and rest 60-70% are increasingly becoming poor with each day and month to pass.
Agree with most of it since I too visit gujarat. But Don't agree with numbers above.

10% people cannot get rich every minute. It's too big of a number. When we talk about india we have to consider lots of undocumented people (not undocument workers like in US)

I believe only about 0.1 to 0.25% at max in Gujarat which is quite prosperous compared to rest of india are to be said rich. Rest you can check statistics but I firmly believe 40% of india is poor or below poor and rest 60% is middle class. You can squeeze 0.1 to 0.25% anywhere you want.

Last edited by USDream2Dust; 11-05-2009 at 10:06 PM.
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  #23 (permalink)  
Old 11-05-2009, 10:15 PM
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Default Be hopeful

India is of course growing, but the growth is not uniform. Only a small percent of people are reaping the benefits of the growth. A major percentage of the popuplation is still below poverty level and there is no sign of any improvement. As someone else said, people who work in certain industries are doing good. Others are still struggling with a mere income.

By the way, narendra_modi just expressed his opinion. Why some idiots are pounding on him? Don't be AHs. People can have a differing opinions and view points. Learn to respect others' opinions. Grow up guys.

The horrible caste system is going to be there for decades to come, because our politicians need it for their survival.

Sure, India will rise as an economic power. Be hopeful.
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  #24 (permalink)  
Old 11-06-2009, 12:38 AM
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Default

An article which gives some #s and analysis on Indian economy. ->HDI Oscars: Slumdogs versus millionaires
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  #25 (permalink)  
Old 11-06-2009, 03:40 AM
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narendra_modi is infamous around these parts narendra_modi is infamous around these parts narendra_modi is infamous around these parts narendra_modi is infamous around these parts narendra_modi is infamous around these parts narendra_modi is infamous around these parts narendra_modi is infamous around these parts narendra_modi is infamous around these parts narendra_modi is infamous around these parts narendra_modi is infamous around these parts
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ita View Post
Don't worry, with Westerners,half Westerners ruling India there's no way India will join the developed nations club.
During the national election in India I did post the piece about how Saino had appointed this group of junkies to lobby with United Nation to take up caste system in India as human rights violation.Seems like the effort was successful.It's a ploy to checkmate India if it ever gets to the point of joining the developed nations club.

Asia Times Online :: South Asia news, business and economy from India and Pakistan

Needless to say the hue and cry in India against this UN's decision is just hog wash and this TOI article could just be a subtle attempt to add credence to UN decision if one goes by the timing.

Vedas,Avataras,Enlightened masters, Indian political reformers,common people (like me) have always condemned untouchability. Don't know how you and people like you miss this simple fact about Vedas.Is it half knowledge or are you part of the camp that thinks the only way to shine is by slinging mud on anything that you envisage as threat to your vested interests?

What is actually left of the practice in India is just like what is left of other evil practices in developed countries.What is depicted by the media about untouchability is unlike what is depicted by the same media about other evils practices prevalent in developed nations.In just that context alone India gets special treatment and the reason for it is anybody's guess. who cares, right ? thats a practice we are following since centuries, so we will, right ??
It's another thing that Indian govt practices caste system in the name of reservations.

AFAIK This thread is not about about your views of Vedas or about where India needs development although you are welcome to have your views.
It's about the quality of life on day-day basis despite westerners ruling the country,despite the caste,religious discrimination encouraged by the govt.
Well, my dear friend, I do not have vested interest, I wanted to just make the forum members(those are not common man of Indian origin) aware that the practice of not allowing lower castes entering into temples still exists even after centuries..forget politics/vote bank/UN etc etc.....

Last edited by narendra_modi; 11-06-2009 at 03:44 AM.
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  #26 (permalink)  
Old 11-06-2009, 10:04 AM
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by narendra_modi View Post
Well, my dear friend, I do not have vested interest, I wanted to just make the forum members(those are not common man of Indian origin) aware that the practice of not allowing lower castes entering into temples still exists even after centuries..forget politics/vote bank/UN etc etc.....
After all the development, even USA has polygamy system in some places. There are many other bad things like very high sexual crime numbers, child molestor priests and so on. Until recently like 1960 blacks were discriminated more than dalits are in India. So will you create a bad impression on the whole country?
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  #27 (permalink)  
Old 11-06-2009, 10:22 AM
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Default Not all in Middle Class are High income

Quote:
Originally Posted by USDream2Dust View Post
Agree with most of it since I too visit gujarat. But Don't agree with numbers above.

10% people cannot get rich every minute. It's too big of a number. When we talk about india we have to consider lots of undocumented people (not undocument workers like in US)

I believe only about 0.1 to 0.25% at max in Gujarat which is quite prosperous compared to rest of india are to be said rich. Rest you can check statistics but I firmly believe 40% of india is poor or below poor and rest 60% is middle class. You can squeeze 0.1 to 0.25% anywhere you want.
your number in Middle class may be right but Defination of Middle class is very broad. I think any one making above 6-8K Rs per Month can come in Middle class also, but they can hardly afford anything except Survival and Food. On other hand rich middle class most if which makes Rs 25K PM or above can Dragg them behind Affluent people (while getting on Loans and debts ) and try to prove that they are not behind any one. Unfortunately in India Social influence is lot on the lifestyle of the peoples, Peoples CARE OVER TOO MUCH ABOUT WHAT OTHER PEOPLES WILL THINK ABOUT THEM AND THEIR FAMILY. WHICH LEAD TO DEBT AND FAMILY SUCIDES In Large proporation Once they get too much in the HOLE which can never be paid off. In Country like US there are no such social pressures and Most of the people can affford Basic needs of life (Which are considered Luxury in India)

So yes there is large middle class but HIGHER MIDDLE CLASS is very SMALL PERCENTAGE.
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old 11-06-2009, 10:53 AM
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Default Depends on what you call "developement"

India will NEVER be a developed country. I repeat, NEVER.
The amount of population and the rate at which it keeps growing, the DEEP and WIDE spread corruption, illiteray and IGNORANCE, total lack of can-do attitude, deep cast/religious/state based divides, rogue neighbor countries, all of this is simply too much.
No amount of money poured into that system will ever be enough. It will ALWAYS be "too little, too late". The rich will get richer and the have-nots will eventually flood the streets and snatch everything from the haves.
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  #29 (permalink)  
Old 11-06-2009, 12:29 PM
ita ita is offline
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by narendra_modi View Post
Well, my dear friend, I do not have vested interest, I wanted to just make the forum members(those are not common man of Indian origin) aware that the practice of not allowing lower castes entering into temples still exists even after centuries..forget politics/vote bank/UN etc etc.....
Exactly dear friend...all I was saying is ,why do you want to take up the burden on your shoulders when media,western politicians in India are doing even better job than you and making sure caste discrimination doesn't go anywhere for centuries to come, at least theoretically? So I was suggesting that you could relax in this context if possible .Anyways it's up to you.


Quote:
Originally Posted by narendra_modi View Post
who cares, right ? thats a practice we are following since centuries, so we will, right ??
.
That's a practice that will not go any where for centuries to come at least theoretically.Who cares right?.There's always Veda's ,Brahmins etc to blame in the pretext of educating 'those are not common man of Indian origin' and not to mention to claim it's not vested interest.


Quote:
Originally Posted by narendra_modi View Post
Well, my dear friend, I do not have vested interest,
Since you cleared it's not vested interest dear friend , then it should be half knowledge.Very dangerous prospect.So now it's up to your 'those are not common man of Indian origin' what they want to believe.
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  #30 (permalink)  
Old 11-06-2009, 12:58 PM
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Default Ways to go

In general I do believe that India has a long way to go. It needs to protect its weaker sections, I mean economically and socially disadvantaged. There are many millions of disadvantaged people even though they are classified as upper caste. I have seen many people from non upper caste behaving super elitist. I don't want to get into argument over this, but its a reality that many don't want to believe.

Agreed I do not have much knowledge of central/northern/eastern states, but the four southern states have fared a lot better in terms of equality and progress when compared with the rest of the country. Today you cannot find a office boy or an employee like it was a decade ago. I feel that Mr. Singh does have a plan in this, and will see what happens.

All said and done we will crib and complain no matter what.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dummgelauft View Post
India will NEVER be a developed country. I repeat, NEVER.
The amount of population and the rate at which it keeps growing, the DEEP and WIDE spread corruption, illiteray and IGNORANCE, total lack of can-do attitude, deep cast/religious/state based divides, rogue neighbor countries, all of this is simply too much.
No amount of money poured into that system will ever be enough. It will ALWAYS be "too little, too late". The rich will get richer and the have-nots will eventually flood the streets and snatch everything from the haves.
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