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  #46 (permalink)  
Old 12-10-2015, 02:18 PM
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Originally Posted by eastindia View Post
You got wrong information. It is an open forum and everyone can air views on both sides of discussion. That does not mean IV is of view of that. IV view is at ImmigrationVoice.org - About Immigration Voice
Thank You and that is what I was hoping for!
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  #47 (permalink)  
Old 12-11-2015, 11:32 AM
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Default Another one from Sessions and Cruz in Senate

Cruz, Sessions Introduce the American Jobs First Act of 2015 | Ted Cruz | U.S. Senator for Texas

Don't know if its good or bad but have certain restrictions.
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  #48 (permalink)  
Old 12-13-2015, 03:49 PM
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Default Cruz eliminates OPT and sets min wage floor for H1B

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Originally Posted by sourab View Post
To summarize this bill:
1. It sets a minimum wage of $110,000
2. It eliminates OPT because this program is being used as a source of cheap labor
3. It bars for a period of two years any company that has had layoffs of American workers from applying for the H1B program.

I am generally in favor of this bill except for 3. Setting a minimum wage of $110,000 ensures that the cheap Indian outsourcing companies are driven out of business in the United States and that only high-quality and well-paid immigrants are hired. I agree with the Elimination of OPT as well because there are so many masters students in computer science who settle for low-quality QA positions.

I would highly hope that they remove stipulation 3 because companies always have to reassess their positions and lay off people because of skill set differences.

I also think that they should keep OPT for PhD level students in STEM.

They should also consider combining elements of this bill with Senator Sessions and Nelsons other bill which proposes handing out H1B visas by highest salary first. If a foreign national is truly that valuable, then they will be able to command that kind of salary.
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  #49 (permalink)  
Old 12-13-2015, 05:18 PM
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Default

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Originally Posted by Jambo View Post
To summarize this bill:
1. It sets a minimum wage of $110,000
2. It eliminates OPT because this program is being used as a source of cheap labor
3. It bars for a period of two years any company that has had layoffs of American workers from applying for the H1B program.

I am generally in favor of this bill except for 3. Setting a minimum wage of $110,000 ensures that the cheap Indian outsourcing companies are driven out of business in the United States and that only high-quality and well-paid immigrants are hired. I agree with the Elimination of OPT as well because there are so many masters students in computer science who settle for low-quality QA positions.

I would highly hope that they remove stipulation 3 because companies always have to reassess their positions and lay off people because of skill set differences.

I also think that they should keep OPT for PhD level students in STEM.

They should also consider combining elements of this bill with Senator Sessions and Nelsons other bill which proposes handing out H1B visas by highest salary first. If a foreign national is truly that valuable, then they will be able to command that kind of salary.
Here are my thoughts -

1. Any idea how many jobs actually pay more than 110K?? How many americans actually get paid that much? Just over 10% of Americans even get paid over that amount. While I agree that the LCA salary determination is something which needs to be a little more stringent, this is outrageous and just a way to make sure H1B's are denied as much as possible.

2. So by this argument, even though someone who has come to study here and performed better than an american student in his class, he is still not going to be able to get hired since of course it hurts the american born guy. The fact a lot of foreign students actually to outshine american born students and companies genuinely might want to give them some training on OPT and hire then on H1B.

3. This in my view is not enforceable. By this logic an incompetent american worker cannot be fired just because the company wants to hire someone else for a completely different position on H1B.

Again "Now that I am here...Please shut the door behind me!" logic is not only bad, its just plain inconsiderate.
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  #50 (permalink)  
Old 12-13-2015, 05:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by javelin768 View Post
Here are my thoughts -

1. Any idea how many jobs actually pay more than 110K?? How many americans actually get paid that much? Just over 10% of Americans even get paid over that amount. While I agree that the LCA salary determination is something which needs to be a little more stringent, this is outrageous and just a way to make sure H1B's are denied as much as possible.

2. So by this argument, even though someone who has come to study here and performed better than an american student in his class, he is still not going to be able to get hired since of course it hurts the american born guy. The fact a lot of foreign students actually to outshine american born students and companies genuinely might want to give them some training on OPT and hire then on H1B.

3. This in my view is not enforceable. By this logic an incompetent american worker cannot be fired just because the company wants to hire someone else for a completely different position on H1B.

Again "Now that I am here...Please shut the door behind me!" logic is not only bad, its just plain inconsiderate.
Oh and another FUN FACT....the 110K figure I quoted of 10% , was for household income. For individuals that number is actually 5%! Sounds awesome ehh...!
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  #51 (permalink)  
Old 12-13-2015, 07:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by javelin768 View Post
Here are my thoughts -

1. Any idea how many jobs actually pay more than 110K?? How many americans actually get paid that much? Just over 10% of Americans even get paid over that amount. While I agree that the LCA salary determination is something which needs to be a little more stringent, this is outrageous and just a way to make sure H1B's are denied as much as possible.

2. So by this argument, even though someone who has come to study here and performed better than an american student in his class, he is still not going to be able to get hired since of course it hurts the american born guy. The fact a lot of foreign students actually to outshine american born students and companies genuinely might want to give them some training on OPT and hire then on H1B.

3. This in my view is not enforceable. By this logic an incompetent american worker cannot be fired just because the company wants to hire someone else for a completely different position on H1B.

Again "Now that I am here...Please shut the door behind me!" logic is not only bad, its just plain inconsiderate.
If a person is best and the brightest 110K is the least he should be paid. So it is a very good bill.

OPT is a backdoor for exploitation. We all know that. It is time this loophole is plugged.

The third point is good because it is a common practice to fire American workers and hire cheep foreign workers. This is a loophole that has caused a bad name to H1B program. I am very happy someone has taken notice and put in the bill.

It is high time we start saying the truth about companies and how the foreign workers are exploited due to loopholes.
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  #52 (permalink)  
Old 12-13-2015, 09:32 PM
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Default Americans first

Quote:
Originally Posted by javelin768 View Post
Here are my thoughts -

1. Any idea how many jobs actually pay more than 110K?? How many americans actually get paid that much? Just over 10% of Americans even get paid over that amount. While I agree that the LCA salary determination is something which needs to be a little more stringent, this is outrageous and just a way to make sure H1B's are denied as much as possible.

2. So by this argument, even though someone who has come to study here and performed better than an american student in his class, he is still not going to be able to get hired since of course it hurts the american born guy. The fact a lot of foreign students actually to outshine american born students and companies genuinely might want to give them some training on OPT and hire then on H1B.

3. This in my view is not enforceable. By this logic an incompetent american worker cannot be fired just because the company wants to hire someone else for a completely different position on H1B.

Again "Now that I am here...Please shut the door behind me!" logic is not only bad, its just plain inconsiderate.
It is not the job of the USA to take care of foreign nationals. If a foreign student has performed better than an American student, then let the salary determine that.

$110K is the starting base salary offered by top tech companies in the Bay Area. Bonuses and stock push that number higher. If anyone makes less than that amount, then they are not complementing the American workforce but rather performing at a level that is just about average to what an American grad performs at.

Foreign students may indeed regularly outperform their American counterparts - and that's because there are so many more foreign Masters and PhD STEM students from abroad. Who's to say that the reason these students are admitted over their American counterparts is because of the high tuition charged which results in higher revenues to universities.

Companies don't care about giving you "training". You are thrown to the wolves and have to learn on the job. That's the real world. I agree with eastindia that it's high time we end this system that screws over both foreign immigrants as well as Americans.
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  #53 (permalink)  
Old 12-14-2015, 08:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jambo View Post
It is not the job of the USA to take care of foreign nationals. If a foreign student has performed better than an American student, then let the salary determine that.

$110K is the starting base salary offered by top tech companies in the Bay Area. Bonuses and stock push that number higher. If anyone makes less than that amount, then they are not complementing the American workforce but rather performing at a level that is just about average to what an American grad performs at.

Foreign students may indeed regularly outperform their American counterparts - and that's because there are so many more foreign Masters and PhD STEM students from abroad. Who's to say that the reason these students are admitted over their American counterparts is because of the high tuition charged which results in higher revenues to universities.

Companies don't care about giving you "training". You are thrown to the wolves and have to learn on the job. That's the real world. I agree with eastindia that it's high time we end this system that screws over both foreign immigrants as well as Americans.
First off 110K in Bay Area is equivalent to 80K in a state like Michigan/Texas. That is the reason having a flat rate is a bad idea. Instead they need to improve the current method of determining the prevailing wage.

Doing away with OPT is not good either. Giving one year should be sufficient and if you want an extension an employer should be able to prove that they applied for an H1 and it did not get picked in the lottery and should pay the prevailing wage for extending OPT. Two year STEM extension is a very bad idea. I agree with you most companies don't provide any training.

Such outrageous bills will never go through.
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  #54 (permalink)  
Old 12-14-2015, 10:03 AM
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jambo View Post
It is not the job of the USA to take care of foreign nationals. If a foreign student has performed better than an American student, then let the salary determine that.

$110K is the starting base salary offered by top tech companies in the Bay Area. Bonuses and stock push that number higher. If anyone makes less than that amount, then they are not complementing the American workforce but rather performing at a level that is just about average to what an American grad performs at.

Foreign students may indeed regularly outperform their American counterparts - and that's because there are so many more foreign Masters and PhD STEM students from abroad. Who's to say that the reason these students are admitted over their American counterparts is because of the high tuition charged which results in higher revenues to universities.

Companies don't care about giving you "training". You are thrown to the wolves and have to learn on the job. That's the real world. I agree with eastindia that it's high time we end this system that screws over both foreign immigrants as well as Americans.
First off, not everyone lives in Bay area. There is a huge population of people living in other states and cities where 110K would be really high salary.
Yes companies care about training, but the fact is, OPT is like cycle of web for people graduating here. The so called legitimate "TOP TECH" companies, that you are referring to, almost every one of them has a training process when they take people in without experience directly from campus.

Honestly how many people came into the US on a H1B which paid 110K salary??? It does not take a wise man to guess that the number will be really low. I could only earn that figure now after 2+ years to staying in the US and changing my job(and I don't live in BAY Area either).

Anyways, it does not benefit in me anyway if this does not go through but yes for the people who legally want to have a shot at working here, I hope Congress has more sense than our first generation indian immigrants, who seem to be intent on pulling each other down.
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  #55 (permalink)  
Old 12-14-2015, 10:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thankstooptx View Post
First off 110K in Bay Area is equivalent to 80K in a state like Michigan/Texas. That is the reason having a flat rate is a bad idea. Instead they need to improve the current method of determining the prevailing wage.

Doing away with OPT is not good either. Giving one year should be sufficient and if you want an extension an employer should be able to prove that they applied for an H1 and it did not get picked in the lottery and should pay the prevailing wage for extending OPT. Two year STEM extension is a very bad idea. I agree with you most companies don't provide any training.

Such outrageous bills will never go through.
I agree with both your suggestions, they seem to be more rooted in reality. Most of these bill's look "TRUMPED UP" to me , pandering to a certain voter base!
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  #56 (permalink)  
Old 12-14-2015, 11:06 AM
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any bill which includes anything to block OPT would never pass .

If all the students stop coming on F1 (with no OPT and lottery H1b ),half the universities would just close business .
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  #57 (permalink)  
Old 12-14-2015, 11:44 AM
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by thankstooptx View Post
First off 110K in Bay Area is equivalent to 80K in a state like Michigan/Texas. That is the reason having a flat rate is a bad idea. Instead they need to improve the current method of determining the prevailing wage.

Doing away with OPT is not good either. Giving one year should be sufficient and if you want an extension an employer should be able to prove that they applied for an H1 and it did not get picked in the lottery and should pay the prevailing wage for extending OPT. Two year STEM extension is a very bad idea. I agree with you most companies don't provide any training.

Such outrageous bills will never go through.
If this bill is implemented lottery will go away on its own. So no need for OPT anymore. OPT is a backdoor for exploitation.
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  #58 (permalink)  
Old 12-14-2015, 11:53 AM
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Originally Posted by panchi2131 View Post
any bill which includes anything to block OPT would never pass .

If all the students stop coming on F1 (with no OPT and lottery H1b ),half the universities would just close business .
There are many Universities like banned trivalley Univ and many third rate universities get majority foreign students. They get money from fees and their classes happen in nights and weekends so that Engineering students work during the day time for SubWay restaurants, Gas Stations and probably in so many other places where they get payments for work they are not authorized to do. There is so much illegal stuff going on out there. These Universities will close down for sure. No American anyways want to join them and no innovation happens there.

Foreign workers graduating from these colleges do not get jobs in top companies. They join consulting companies for low salaries and get exploited. H1Bs coming from India also mostly come via consulting companies and are known to work on low salaries. It is high time all this is stopped and foreign workers get high salaries they truly deserve.
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  #59 (permalink)  
Old 12-14-2015, 12:34 PM
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Originally Posted by eastindia View Post
There are many Universities like banned trivalley Univ and many third rate universities get majority foreign students. They get money from fees and their classes happen in nights and weekends so that Engineering students work during the day time for SubWay restaurants, Gas Stations and probably in so many other places where they get payments for work they are not authorized to do. There is so much illegal stuff going on out there. These Universities will close down for sure. No American anyways want to join them and no innovation happens there.

Foreign workers graduating from these colleges do not get jobs in top companies. They join consulting companies for low salaries and get exploited. H1Bs coming from India also mostly come via consulting companies and are known to work on low salaries. It is high time all this is stopped and foreign workers get high salaries they truly deserve.
By that logic, since there is so much exploitation of the people trying to migrate here legally and getting a green card , please BAN all Employment based GC now. It creates less opportunities for American people and more competition which is really BAD!

If there is a problem in the system, then it needs to be regulated with stricter rules. Banning bright students from coming and studying and working here is ONLY going to ensure brain drain.

Oh yeah, the exploitation you are pointing out here, is BECAUSE of the restrictions put on OPT students. They don't have mobility and flexibility because a lot of US employers don't want to go through the process of sponsoring them and hence have to work for consultancies who will eventually sponsor Visas.
If they were NOT good, they would not survive in the Job market would They??
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  #60 (permalink)  
Old 12-14-2015, 01:20 PM
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Originally Posted by eastindia View Post
There are many Universities like banned trivalley Univ and many third rate universities get majority foreign students. They get money from fees and their classes happen in nights and weekends so that Engineering students work during the day time for SubWay restaurants, Gas Stations and probably in so many other places where they get payments for work they are not authorized to do. There is so much illegal stuff going on out there. These Universities will close down for sure. No American anyways want to join them and no innovation happens there.

Foreign workers graduating from these colleges do not get jobs in top companies. They join consulting companies for low salaries and get exploited. H1Bs coming from India also mostly come via consulting companies and are known to work on low salaries. It is high time all this is stopped and foreign workers get high salaries they truly deserve.
so u mean to say 100,000 students who every year wud spend 30k on universities ,and the universities would not be effected if they stop coming .

Guess u havent seen the state's budgets where in states are continuosly cutting budgets to these universities ...
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