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Retrogression, priority dates and Visa bulletins Issues surrounding the retrogression of the priority dates for the various employment based categories

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  #61 (permalink)  
Old 04-24-2008, 11:53 AM
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Default Time to Grow Up!

Folks, it is time for the H1B community to grow up. Business is business. I am not a blood sucking deshi firm, or a silent partner. On the contrary, I happen to be a trained mediator, published author on conflict management and professional in strategy/organizations. My view is pretty simple: mathematical 'tit for tat' doesnt take you far. Build, nourish and manage relationships. Money and math are secondary. Its time to grow up.

MR. Obviously
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Last edited by obviously; 08-28-2011 at 08:57 AM.
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  #62 (permalink)  
Old 04-24-2008, 11:55 AM
Senior Member
Priority Date
:
Dec-03
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EB3
I140 Mailed Date
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08/10/2007
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kg318 View Post
Guyz, i met attorney. got copy of non compete agreement from a co-worker. I feel kind of releived after what he said.

As per him, every non-compete agreement that is signed cannot be neccessarily enforced in the court of law. If the sole purpose is to avoid ordinary competition, it is unreasonable and unenforceable. If the agreement is ever challenged in court, the most important question, which will be posed from the Judge to the employer, is "What is the legitimate business purpose that is served by this non-compete agreement?"


Now as h1b employees, as every one knows we r not the key personnel in the company. we do not carry with us any trade secrets or confidential information which might harm their business.

AS per him the higher up the "food chain" an employee is at a company, the more willing courts are to enforce non-compete agreements. Upper level employees are typically exposed to more confidential, trade secret, strategic and other information that gives a company a competitive advantage in the market place. The lower down the food chain an employee is, the less likely a court is to enforce non-compete and non-solicitation terms.


Also non competes always have to give some profits to the employee, say a paid vacation, bonus or somethign like that. An employer cannot
just make the employee sign it to restrict him from making better living and not give anything in return....


Seems like these things are favourable to all the h1b employees.
If any employer is claiming non compete to hold the consultant to his company, then even he should not take employees from competetive companies..... But r they doing it???????? We all know the answer.... IT consulting businesses run like that.
Did you ask Attorney what happens if your employer still choose to Sue you? My friend's attorney told most of cases will be settled, but we might loose money up to 10K. Is it woth it doing? Also if we choose to fight, we might have to attend hearing (may be in different state based on your agreement). I am an employee too, and with you on this. I'd say if attorney guarentees he'll win our case we can go ahead.

Last edited by gcbikari; 04-24-2008 at 12:00 PM.
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  #63 (permalink)  
Old 04-24-2008, 12:18 PM
Senior Member
Priority Date
:
Nov-03
Category
:
EB2
I140 Mailed Date
:
12/12/2005
Chargeability
:
India
Processing Stage
:
I-485
I485 Mailed Date
:
06/27/2007
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Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 115
aquarianf is on a distinguished road
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kshitijnt View Post
Guys one more perspective:

1) Employers are not in the business of litigations. Their business is to run the company. If you or the employers are talking lawsuits then one of you have crossed a red line. It is just that. No sensible person goes to the court knowing he has done wrong. I doubt an employer wants lawsuits. Just like you feel threatened by lawsuits, your employer also feels threatened by lawsuits.

2) Surabhi - nothing personal, but your post reflect how the ideal world should be. However world is not your way always.

3) I agree with acquarian, that it is very stressful if employer threatens to sue you. Also attorneys will charge you $200/ per hr. If someone is saying that attorneys recover money later etc, I say chill. Most attorneys would not do that. They like hourly rates. Its very difficuilt to find an attorney for free unless your case is slam dunk.

Why I suggested he apologize? Be humble. I did not say admit your mistake. I just said aplogize for employers grievance. If two simple words "I apologize" can get your job done, why waste time in attorneys court, etc?

Based on my past experience, I am telling you, you never know when you will need a past employer. You will not need your past client, I have been at atleast 10 client sites, I never needed a past client for something, but I always had to go back to my employers for something. They are like ex GFs or ex spouses and leaving a job is like divorce.

Where you will need your employer? When USCIS sends you an RFE to prove employment experience with XXX company. There is nothing in the law that forces employers to give you an experience letter unless he fired you. Now try getting a court order in 90 days to meet your RFE deadline

When you get a job in fortune 500 company or better opportunity after your GC, your future employer will want to talk to all employers in ur history. Ready for that? Want to give the number now or want to let the job go?

Thats why I am saying DO NOT fight with ex employers. You will get hurt more than the employer. Your ex boss is not a bad guy, he knows you are leaving for better opportunity. Since he remembers what you have done for him, a few kind words will solve the matter.

I needed one such reference in my past, I called and apologized to my former boss because if I didnt, he would not cooperate and nor I had time for years worth of lawsuits. It took about a month, but the matter was settled in my favour.


I agree with kshitijnt that you need past employer more than you need client. In my case I had received 485 query to supply some my employment related docs ( whether that I am working with responser or working with someone else, letter from company showing my current position,sal. etc). Since I didn't change my employer, it was very easy and quick to get such documents from current employer. Imagine if I would have switched on EAD then I would have to chase my past employer for letters, paystubs etc and by the I would got them from past employer,I faced the risk of PD moving back.
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  #64 (permalink)  
Old 04-24-2008, 12:29 PM
Senior Member
Priority Date
:
Apr-04
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I140 Mailed Date
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Bangladesh
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N/A
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Default

Another silent deshi employer here trying to scar H1s not to sue. I guess he created his ID (Join Date: Apr 2008) just for this.
Go and create another website in favour of deshi blood su&^%$rs called reverse-IV.org. Don't try to mock here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by gcbikari View Post
Did you ask Attorney what happens if your employer still choose to Sue you? My friend's attorney told most of cases will be settled, but we might loose money up to 10K. Is it woth it doing? Also if we choose to fight, we might have to attend hearing (may be in different state based on your agreement). I am an employee too, and with you on this. I'd say if attorney guarentees he'll win our case we can go ahead.
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  #65 (permalink)  
Old 04-24-2008, 12:29 PM
Senior Member
Priority Date
:
Nov-03
Category
:
EB2
I140 Mailed Date
:
12/12/2005
Chargeability
:
India
Processing Stage
:
I-485
I485 Mailed Date
:
06/27/2007
Compare
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 115
aquarianf is on a distinguished road
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by kg318 View Post
Guyz, i met attorney. got copy of non compete agreement from a co-worker. I feel kind of releived after what he said.

As per him, every non-compete agreement that is signed cannot be neccessarily enforced in the court of law. If the sole purpose is to avoid ordinary competition, it is unreasonable and unenforceable. If the agreement is ever challenged in court, the most important question, which will be posed from the Judge to the employer, is "What is the legitimate business purpose that is served by this non-compete agreement?"


Now as h1b employees, as every one knows we r not the key personnel in the company. we do not carry with us any trade secrets or confidential information which might harm their business.

AS per him the higher up the "food chain" an employee is at a company, the more willing courts are to enforce non-compete agreements. Upper level employees are typically exposed to more confidential, trade secret, strategic and other information that gives a company a competitive advantage in the market place. The lower down the food chain an employee is, the less likely a court is to enforce non-compete and non-solicitation terms.


Also non competes always have to give some profits to the employee, say a paid vacation, bonus or somethign like that. An employer cannot
just make the employee sign it to restrict him from making better living and not give anything in return....


Seems like these things are favourable to all the h1b employees.
If any employer is claiming non compete to hold the consultant to his company, then even he should not take employees from competetive companies..... But r they doing it???????? We all know the answer.... IT consulting businesses run like that.


can you ask the attorney if he can work on contingency basis? Or did he gave any estimate of how much it may cost you if you have to face lawsiute or if you have to go to settlement route?
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  #66 (permalink)  
Old 04-24-2008, 12:44 PM
Senior Member
Priority Date
:
Dec-03
Category
:
EB3
I140 Mailed Date
:
08/10/2007
Chargeability
:
India
Processing Stage
:
I-140+I-485
I485 Mailed Date
:
08/10/2007
Compare
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 133
gcbikari has a reputation beyond repute gcbikari has a reputation beyond repute gcbikari has a reputation beyond repute gcbikari has a reputation beyond repute gcbikari has a reputation beyond repute gcbikari has a reputation beyond repute gcbikari has a reputation beyond repute gcbikari has a reputation beyond repute gcbikari has a reputation beyond repute gcbikari has a reputation beyond repute gcbikari has a reputation beyond repute
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by gc4me View Post
Another silent deshi employer here trying to scar H1s not to sue. I guess he created his ID (Join Date: Apr 2008) just for this.
Go and create another website in favour of deshi blood su&^%$rs called reverse-IV.org. Don't try to mock here.
Oh Boy. What I wanted to know was if attorney is willing to work on contigency basis (couldn't get that word right), then we can risk. I wish I was a desi employer. I know in a chaos situation everyone is a suspect. I didn't give more accurate info in my profile because, i know some of my colleagues spy for my employer. I am in my 9th year on h1 and still struggling. though i said example of my friend, i personally paid 350 to a labor attorney last week to evaluate my non-compete. no matter who says what, i again repeat u either have to spend money and or loose job if you violate. ofcourse each case is different and has to be reviewed.

BTW I believe H1 issue and non-compete are different. I think (y)our desperate situation and anger on h1b process is leading to this reply. but non-compete comes under labor and employment.

Last edited by gcbikari; 04-24-2008 at 12:48 PM.
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  #67 (permalink)  
Old 04-24-2008, 02:31 PM
NKR NKR is offline
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Priority Date
:
Aug-04
Category
:
EB2
I140 Mailed Date
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08/05/2007
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India
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I-485
I485 Mailed Date
:
08/05/2007
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Join Date: Jan 2008
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NKR has a reputation beyond repute NKR has a reputation beyond repute NKR has a reputation beyond repute NKR has a reputation beyond repute NKR has a reputation beyond repute NKR has a reputation beyond repute NKR has a reputation beyond repute NKR has a reputation beyond repute NKR has a reputation beyond repute NKR has a reputation beyond repute NKR has a reputation beyond repute
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Quote:
Originally Posted by obviously View Post
Folks, it is time for the H1B community to grow up. Business is business. I am not a blood sucking deshi firm, or a silent partner. On the contrary, I happen to be a trained mediator, published author on conflict management and professional in strategy/organizations. My view is pretty simple: mathematical 'tit for tat' doesnt take you far. Build, nourish and manage relationships. Money and math are secondary. Its time to grow up.

MR. Obviously
Quite right, I know you meant that managing relationships has to be from both the sides, but with most desi employers it has become a one way street. Even with all the effort to manage relationship, the employee still gets scr*** and this needs to stop.
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  #68 (permalink)  
Old 04-24-2008, 02:50 PM
Senior Member
Priority Date
:
Oct-05
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:
EB2
I140 Mailed Date
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:
India
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:
Labor Certification
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NKR View Post
Quite right, I know you meant that managing relationships has to be from both the sides, but with most desi employers it has become a one way street. Even with all the effort to manage relationship, the employee still gets scr*** and this needs to stop.
Do you have any suggestions?
__________________
-------------------------------------------
*********************************
PD : EB2 - India - 02/2003
I140 -
Received Date 07-02-07
Approval Date 01-30-08
I485(me and spouse) -Received Date 07-02-07
RFE 02-05-08
RFE response Received Date -03-20-08
Soft LUD 3-21-2008
Soft LUD 3-24-2008
Soft LUD 3-25-2008
i485 approval card production ordered -4/3/2008
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  #69 (permalink)  
Old 04-24-2008, 03:47 PM
NKR NKR is offline
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Priority Date
:
Aug-04
Category
:
EB2
I140 Mailed Date
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08/05/2007
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India
Processing Stage
:
I-485
I485 Mailed Date
:
08/05/2007
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Join Date: Jan 2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vinabath View Post
Do you have any suggestions?
Yes I do.

If the employee needs to leave after two years and if he has had a good track record, relieve him in good terms, donít scr** him.

If the employee helps in your business, you got to help him too (Just like the referral policy), donít think that just because he works for you, he is obliged to help you in your business in other means, it is not in his list of roles and responsibilities.

It is the employerís duty too to find projects, if the employee finds project for himself, then reward him with bonus.

Above all, the desi employers need to come out of cheap mentality and become more professionals.

Not that you care but I can give you more suggestions.
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  #70 (permalink)  
Old 04-24-2008, 05:15 PM
Junior Member
Priority Date
:
Dec-07
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EB2
I140 Mailed Date
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India
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kg318 is on a distinguished road
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by gc4me View Post
Another silent deshi employer here trying to scar H1s not to sue. I guess he created his ID (Join Date: Apr 2008) just for this.
Go and create another website in favour of deshi blood su&^%$rs called reverse-IV.org. Don't try to mock here.

i agree with u gc4me. he seems to be one among my employer's company. if u see, he has replied only for this post, nothing other than this post. except this issue, he doesn't seem to be interested in any other issues in this forum..earlier he said his friend paid $350 for evaluation of non compete and now he says he himself paid $350 to attorney. how can anyone be 9 yrs on
h1b. its only max of 6+ 7th yr extension. its not that i want to hear what i want to hear, but people come up here for genuine opinions of members here. so gcbikari(i doubt u r a desi emplyer), please dont use ur strategy of scaring the employees to death. that will spoil the whole essense of the forum.
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  #71 (permalink)  
Old 04-24-2008, 06:16 PM
Senior Member
Priority Date
:
Feb-02
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:
Others
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:
India
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N/A
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raj2007 will become famous soon enough raj2007 will become famous soon enough
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by aquarianf View Post
I agree with kshitijnt that you need past employer more than you need client. In my case I had received 485 query to supply some my employment related docs ( whether that I am working with responser or working with someone else, letter from company showing my current position,sal. etc). Since I didn't change my employer, it was very easy and quick to get such documents from current employer. Imagine if I would have switched on EAD then I would have to chase my past employer for letters, paystubs etc and by the I would got them from past employer,I faced the risk of PD moving back.
Your case is different becasue you filed your I-485 with them. Here he has not started 485 at all.I don't know how he can maintain good relation with them. Some employer are too torugh to deal and same goes with some employees too.
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  #72 (permalink)  
Old 04-24-2008, 09:10 PM
Junior Member
Priority Date
:
Dec-07
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:
EB2
I140 Mailed Date
:
Chargeability
:
India
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:
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:
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Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 14
kg318 is on a distinguished road
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[quote=gcbikari;242385]Did you ask Attorney what happens if your employer still choose to Sue you? My friend's attorney told most of cases will be settled, but we might loose money up to 10K. Is it woth it doing? Also if we choose to fight, we might have to attend hearing (may be in different state based on your agreement). I am an employee too, and with you on this. I'd say if attorney guarentees he'll win our case we can go ahead.[/QUOTE

as per the attorney, the case history of employers who won using non competes in the court are very rare unless the law suit is agiainst key personnel and court gets convinced by the legitemate business interest. If the employer still chooses to fight, he has got more to loose than me because of non payments of wages also being involved here. since non compete has been used just to escape the wages, courts wil be more hard on the employer and will consider it as threat rather than genuine.
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  #73 (permalink)  
Old 04-24-2008, 10:49 PM
Omm Omm is offline
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:
Feb-08
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:
Others
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:
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Omm is infamous around these parts Omm is infamous around these parts Omm is infamous around these parts Omm is infamous around these parts Omm is infamous around these parts
Default Perfect Man

It high time that these guys get kicked on what ever, I have seen so many of my friends frustated due to non payment and get scarred to do anything against it..... I appreciate your courage , If they do bussiness and employ people they should legally pay, So many poeple come from India with kids and family and suffer so much when they are not getting paid on bench...I can only sympathise with their situation , Shame on such bussiness...BLOOD SUCKERS, MANIACS . I would say USCIS should create a law to punish these blood sucking monsters.
Training, H1b ...etc takes money ...so what he not stupid(desi employer) to do it for free , He makes altleast 10 times of what he spends in just 6 months when the candidate is on project.

I am sure I am going to get a lot of negative feedback for posting this in from ...so hiding desi employers

Last edited by Omm; 04-24-2008 at 10:52 PM.
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  #74 (permalink)  
Old 04-25-2008, 11:27 AM
Senior Member
Priority Date
:
Nov-03
Category
:
EB2
I140 Mailed Date
:
12/12/2005
Chargeability
:
India
Processing Stage
:
I-485
I485 Mailed Date
:
06/27/2007
Compare
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 115
aquarianf is on a distinguished road
Default

[quote=kg318;242627]
Quote:
Originally Posted by gcbikari View Post
Did you ask Attorney what happens if your employer still choose to Sue you? My friend's attorney told most of cases will be settled, but we might loose money up to 10K. Is it woth it doing? Also if we choose to fight, we might have to attend hearing (may be in different state based on your agreement). I am an employee too, and with you on this. I'd say if attorney guarentees he'll win our case we can go ahead.[/QUOTE

as per the attorney, the case history of employers who won using non competes in the court are very rare unless the law suit is agiainst key personnel and court gets convinced by the legitemate business interest. If the employer still chooses to fight, he has got more to loose than me because of non payments of wages also being involved here. since non compete has been used just to escape the wages, courts wil be more hard on the employer and will consider it as threat rather than genuine.
Did you contacted INS regarding this? Someone in my office told that one of his friend contacted INS regarding back wages. He received a phone call 3-4 months later from INS regarding his complain and was told that INS will investigate into the matter and if complain is valid then the former employer will be punished accordingly. He was told that INS has received many many such complaints and they have huge backlog and it is taking 3-4 months to reach to a complain but they are working on each of them.
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  #75 (permalink)  
Old 04-25-2008, 11:39 AM
Senior Member
Priority Date
:
Nov-03
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:
EB2
I140 Mailed Date
:
12/12/2005
Chargeability
:
India
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:
I-485
I485 Mailed Date
:
06/27/2007
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Posts: 115
aquarianf is on a distinguished road
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Omm View Post
It high time that these guys get kicked on what ever, I have seen so many of my friends frustated due to non payment and get scarred to do anything against it..... I appreciate your courage , If they do bussiness and employ people they should legally pay, So many poeple come from India with kids and family and suffer so much when they are not getting paid on bench...I can only sympathise with their situation , Shame on such bussiness...BLOOD SUCKERS, MANIACS . I would say USCIS should create a law to punish these blood sucking monsters.
Training, H1b ...etc takes money ...so what he not stupid(desi employer) to do it for free , He makes altleast 10 times of what he spends in just 6 months when the candidate is on project.

I am sure I am going to get a lot of negative feedback for posting this in from ...so hiding desi employers
I agree with some of your points but you are not helping on anything here by appreciating OP's courage. If OP gets into law suite and if it requires lots of money would you be willing to donate some money to fight law suite because it will not only help OP but it will scare such shameless employer that there people out there in community who are willing to help if they do something wrong with employees.

I agree with you that such employer should be punished but it is more important to create awareness about their practice specially among people who just come from India and then get into trap of such employers. But many people do so even after knowing the facts about desi employers. Every thing has risks and rewards, and many people know risks but they get into it for rewards.

It seems that INS is very serious about holding back wages issue I think first thing people do is to file complaint with INS. See my previous post on this.
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