Immigration Voice

Immigration Voice (https://immigrationvoice.org/forum/)
-   Retrogression, priority dates and Visa bulletins (https://immigrationvoice.org/forum/forum2-retrogression-priority-dates-and-visa-bulletins/)
-   -   threats from employer (https://immigrationvoice.org/forum/forum2-retrogression-priority-dates-and-visa-bulletins/18669-threats-from-employer.html)

kg318 04-19-2008 11:01 PM

threats from employer
 
I work for company A which sent me to client C through company B(Prefered vendor). After working with the same client for 1.5 yrs, transfered my h1b to company B(PF) due to issues with the pay with company A. Company A has deducted huge sum of money($4000) from my last months pay towards PERM filing(Still under process). Upon demanding them to reimburse my money saying that its against law, they r threatening me saying that based on non-compete agreement they will take legal action against me.
I am not actually aware of the clauses in the agreement. company B(PF) told me that it does not have any clauses in its agreement with company A prohibiting them from taking me.Though i requested company A to provide me a copy of non-compete, they said i signed with them, they haven´t. The company is located in NJ and not sure how non-competes work under NJ state law.
I am really frustated upon this blackmail and going thru lot of pressure. The amount is too big too leave and cannot afford to hire a lawyer in case they file suit based on non-compete. even if i had signed a non compete agreement how does it stand as it is conflicting the agreement which company a signed with PF sayign tht upon my termination of the emplyment with them, Pf can take me without any gap period... what can i do to get my money. they also refused to provide me with experience letter which i need for my future GC filing.
Plz give me ur valuable inputs

vinabath 04-19-2008 11:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kg318 (Post 241222)
I work for company A which sent me to client C through company B(Prefered vendor). After working with the same client for 1.5 yrs, transfered my h1b to company B(PF) due to issues with the pay with company A. Company A has deducted huge sum of money($4000) from my last months pay towards PERM filing(Still under process). Upon demanding them to reimburse my money saying that its against law, they r threatening me saying that based on non-compete agreement they will take legal action against me.
I am not actually aware of the clauses in the agreement. company B(PF) told me that it does not have any clauses in its agreement with company A prohibiting them from taking me.Though i requested company A to provide me a copy of non-compete, they said i signed with them, they haven´t. The company is located in NJ and not sure how non-competes work under NJ state law.
I am really frustated upon this blackmail and going thru lot of pressure. The amount is too big too leave and cannot afford to hire a lawyer in case they file suit based on non-compete. even if i had signed a non compete agreement how does it stand as it is conflicting the agreement which company a signed with PF sayign tht upon my termination of the emplyment with them, Pf can take me without any gap period... what can i do to get my money. they also refused to provide me with experience letter which i need for my future GC filing.
Plz give me ur valuable inputs

i think as long as you are not working for the same client after you moving to the preferred vendor you should be good. Usually non-competes are created to protect their business. this is the simple non-compete. i think there are 2 solutions in your situation.

1. If company A is doing lot of business with company B or Client. You can ask help for the vendor or client to convince A. usually A should will oblige as they might risk future business from Vendor or Client.

2. As you have already told which company you would be working for.... ask A for a raise.....

As far experience letters are concerned...... they have to give it.

ski_dude12 04-20-2008 02:29 AM

What is the name of your employer? Atleast it will help others to be aware of them.

snathan 04-20-2008 11:19 AM

Dont Worry
 
Normally the employer will thread like this. But they wont do anything because if they sue you, they have to spend lot of money then what you have to pay them. Just reply like this.

1. I am ready to face the law suit, I got my attorny and ready to take legal action and I know how to deal with you.
2. I give you this many XX days. Pay me or I am going to refer this case to DOL and DHS.
3. Definitely they will not do anything. Once you refer them to DOL and DHS they are screwed. DHS security will investigate this and if there is any violation of law, this employer can not do any H1 for any one and all their GC process would be in limbo.

Simply they can not afford to take legal action or face DHS. If I were you I would do whatever it takes to recover my money. I wont let them go without hard time.

Be bold and do this.

gc_kaavaali 04-20-2008 11:32 AM

Hi,
As far as my knowledge is concerned they cannot hold your wage amount...this is against law...They have to pay your wages completely...If you owe them they have to talk/fight (through law suit or something else) with you seperately...but that too after paying your wages...You can fight for your salary.


Quote:

Originally Posted by kg318 (Post 241222)
I work for company A which sent me to client C through company B(Prefered vendor). After working with the same client for 1.5 yrs, transfered my h1b to company B(PF) due to issues with the pay with company A. Company A has deducted huge sum of money($4000) from my last months pay towards PERM filing(Still under process). Upon demanding them to reimburse my money saying that its against law, they r threatening me saying that based on non-compete agreement they will take legal action against me.
I am not actually aware of the clauses in the agreement. company B(PF) told me that it does not have any clauses in its agreement with company A prohibiting them from taking me.Though i requested company A to provide me a copy of non-compete, they said i signed with them, they haven´t. The company is located in NJ and not sure how non-competes work under NJ state law.
I am really frustated upon this blackmail and going thru lot of pressure. The amount is too big too leave and cannot afford to hire a lawyer in case they file suit based on non-compete. even if i had signed a non compete agreement how does it stand as it is conflicting the agreement which company a signed with PF sayign tht upon my termination of the emplyment with them, Pf can take me without any gap period... what can i do to get my money. they also refused to provide me with experience letter which i need for my future GC filing.
Plz give me ur valuable inputs


gcwait2007 04-20-2008 01:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kg318 (Post 241222)
I work for company A which sent me to client C through company B(Prefered vendor). After working with the same client for 1.5 yrs, transfered my h1b to company B(PF) due to issues with the pay with company A. Company A has deducted huge sum of money($4000) from my last months pay towards PERM filing(Still under process). Upon demanding them to reimburse my money saying that its against law, they r threatening me saying that based on non-compete agreement they will take legal action against me.
I am not actually aware of the clauses in the agreement. company B(PF) told me that it does not have any clauses in its agreement with company A prohibiting them from taking me.Though i requested company A to provide me a copy of non-compete, they said i signed with them, they haven´t. The company is located in NJ and not sure how non-competes work under NJ state law.
I am really frustated upon this blackmail and going thru lot of pressure. The amount is too big too leave and cannot afford to hire a lawyer in case they file suit based on non-compete. even if i had signed a non compete agreement how does it stand as it is conflicting the agreement which company a signed with PF sayign tht upon my termination of the emplyment with them, Pf can take me without any gap period... what can i do to get my money. they also refused to provide me with experience letter which i need for my future GC filing.
Plz give me ur valuable inputs

I work for a company which recovers expenses incurred for relocation, training, certification exam fee paid, GC expenses, etc if I choose to leave them with in one year of incurring expenses. It seems to be a common practice. Many times, these recovery is waived at the discretion of the managers.

kshitijnt 04-20-2008 03:28 PM

non compete
 
I would probably not worry too much about it. You probably signed a non compete not to join company B. You can save 4K in like 2-3 months. This company may have used the same tactic at multiple places. For future ref., just keep the non compete with you when you sign it.

ram04 04-20-2008 06:48 PM

Blood suckers
 
It is normal practice with all companys to do that with every change.
Even after years of slavery to them they keep doing this.

As per history they say no company won the case of Non compete agrement against employee so far in court of law.

I got my arears money from one of the India's reputed software company (after a year' s correspondance)only after I warned them that I will inform labor dept.

Ofcourse as another member suggested, it is better to keep yourself at peace and get along as long as your immigration status is not disturbed by those blood suckers.

All the best.

kg318 04-20-2008 10:23 PM

thanks a lot
 
thanks a lot guyz for all ur replies. My only concern is can they claim the GC expenses(lawyer fee and advertisement costs involved in PERM filing) as the expenses they incurred because of me leaving the company if they file a law suit using non compete. There is no other expense relocation, training or another kind of expense that company has incurred for me(not a single penny except h1b filing). and one more thing i want to let u know is that i am workign with the same client just changed my h1b to PF. Will that be a trouble??? As i have already mentioned earlier in the agreement of company A with PF when i joined the company clearly specifies that PF can take me immediately upon my termination with company A.

fide_champ 04-20-2008 10:34 PM

Report them to USCIS and blacklist them. They don't get anything by suing you. They have more to lose if you report them to USCIS.

kg318 04-20-2008 11:00 PM

company A
 
hi guyz,

Here u go. The company name is 3i Infotech Inc. based in NJ.

karthkc 04-20-2008 11:24 PM

Assess situation...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by kg318 (Post 241317)
hi guyz,

Here u go. The company name is 3i Infotech Inc. based in NJ.

Googling the company name brings up some interesting information. The company seems to be well-established and looks like it has some ties to the federal government in terms of clientele..

I would assess the situation carefully and come up with a strategy before you take further steps...

obviously 04-21-2008 07:26 AM

Good Employer Relations
 
kg318... from your initial post you indicated that you "demanded" money back and noted that Company A's practice was "against the law". Now, they are using the same law against you. Not saying it is fair or pretty. Just remember, what you sow, you shall reap.

It is generally poor practice to go for gung-ho activism in a situation where you are unclear about the law (e.g., non compete) and unable to get good counsel (e.g. immigration and business law attorneys).

Just keep this in mind. Long term, your peace of mind is worth more than $4K ... just think if there are other ways in which you could have handled this.... in case such event pop up again.

If I were you, I would have a civil conversation with that company. Tell them that economics took over empathy, that you wish to be in a position where you have less financial loss and would appreciate an amicable parting of ways.
It's a small world out there. Dont pi*s on anyone, lest it come back to wet your backside!

Sabre rattling might get you out of this one, but the world still remains a small place!
________
LadiDi

pointlesswait 04-21-2008 10:27 AM

File a BBB case..but make sure you are absolutely sure Company is at fault...if its just money..
i guess u have to take a "hit".. but if they have violated ur rights in any way..u should pursue all possible options of getting justice.

is that a desi consultant!
I think we need to create a site of all desi consultants and rate them.. discretely.;-)

sankar_203 04-21-2008 11:32 AM

Ur fine
 
i guess ur fine. My collegue here won similar case in NJ. I am sure they'll pay u if u put little pressure on them. I would think twice before i report him to DOL & DHS only the reason being it might affect all other employees that are currently working for your previous company. If they don't pay u, i guess u have no choice to go for a fomal complaint.

raj2007 04-21-2008 04:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kg318 (Post 241222)
I work for company A which sent me to client C through company B(Prefered vendor). After working with the same client for 1.5 yrs, transfered my h1b to company B(PF) due to issues with the pay with company A. Company A has deducted huge sum of money($4000) from my last months pay towards PERM filing(Still under process). Upon demanding them to reimburse my money saying that its against law, they r threatening me saying that based on non-compete agreement they will take legal action against me.
I am not actually aware of the clauses in the agreement. company B(PF) told me that it does not have any clauses in its agreement with company A prohibiting them from taking me.Though i requested company A to provide me a copy of non-compete, they said i signed with them, they haven´t. The company is located in NJ and not sure how non-competes work under NJ state law.
I am really frustated upon this blackmail and going thru lot of pressure. The amount is too big too leave and cannot afford to hire a lawyer in case they file suit based on non-compete. even if i had signed a non compete agreement how does it stand as it is conflicting the agreement which company a signed with PF sayign tht upon my termination of the emplyment with them, Pf can take me without any gap period... what can i do to get my money. they also refused to provide me with experience letter which i need for my future GC filing.
Plz give me ur valuable inputs

Can you get the copy of non-compete agreement from other coworker?
You should have copy of any agreement or any paper you sign with employer.

eastwest 04-21-2008 04:50 PM

Get it in writing
 
Here is what you do,

1. Do not talk to them on phone
2. Send them a letter stating keeping your salary is against law. If they think you owe them the money, send you a letter explaining why they think the money is owed and how much, state that filing of labor is a cost to the company and not to the employee as per DOL
3. Give them a time limit of 30 days.
4. Ask them to send all the correspondence to your home address.
5. Send them a letter with some kind signature rcpt.

Wait and see, If they have a real claim then they will respond to you otherwise they will send your money.

gcbikari 04-21-2008 05:40 PM

Careful
 
I have a friend who got offer like u. He is cautious and paid $350 and met an Employment attorney re. non-compete. If u work at same desk and perform same duties as with ur prior employer, attorney told it comes under violation (as per his aggreement, if it says 'directly or indirectly' ). If they sue you u have to pay the loss and leave the job. The question is will ur employer Sue? He might get sued back for violations he did like missing payments to you, and many other dirty tricks to save money!!

The more u know the more complicated is non-compete, search online forums on non-compete. u can also consult some attorneys online.

Easy way may be talk to him and try to settle. Otherwise ask for your agreement and get it reviewed by an attorney.

vinabath 04-22-2008 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by obviously (Post 241337)
kg318... from your initial post you indicated that you "demanded" money back and noted that Company A's practice was "against the law". Now, they are using the same law against you. Not saying it is fair or pretty. Just remember, what you sow, you shall reap.

It is generally poor practice to go for gung-ho activism in a situation where you are unclear about the law (e.g., non compete) and unable to get good counsel (e.g. immigration and business law attorneys).

Just keep this in mind. Long term, your peace of mind is worth more than $4K ... just think if there are other ways in which you could have handled this.... in case such event pop up again.

If I were you, I would have a civil conversation with that company. Tell them that economics took over empathy, that you wish to be in a position where you have less financial loss and would appreciate an amicable parting of ways.
It's a small world out there. Dont pi*s on anyone, lest it come back to wet your backside!

Sabre rattling might get you out of this one, but the world still remains a small place!

I agree with this post. Solve this amicably. Non-compete clause is a strong one and is one-sided.

If you are worrying about 4k you are worrying on the wrong thing. You need to worry about the non-compete.

nitkad 04-22-2008 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kg318 (Post 241317)
hi guyz,

Here u go. The company name is 3i Infotech Inc. based in NJ.

As far as I know this is a genuine company and not a typical small desi company.
Did you sign some paper saying that you will reimburse the GC costs if you leave the company? If it was signed before the GC process started then it is not against the law that the company is holding back the $4K. This is a big company and I don't think the $4k matters to them much.

As far as experience letter, they have to give it.

Also, sometimes we get mad at the company even though its our own mistake. So, before filling anything with the labor department, make sure you have not signed the papers. By reporting them you are basically giving trouble to others who are in GC process through them.

Gravitation 04-22-2008 12:51 PM

Non-compete are notoriously hard to implement. Most of the courts don't want to prevent people from earning a livelihood. When Microsoft sued its ex-employee who joined Google, it was a rare exception when any company even bothered to sue for a non-compete.

The reason your employer is not willing to give you a copy of what you signed is that they fear you'll take it to an attorney and she/he will tell you it means nothing. Anyhow, non-compete is the last thing you need to worry about.

If they illegally withheld your pay for GC expenses, you can make things difficult for them. But in that case you should hire and attorney and she/he should write them a letter and ask for your money back. If you beg them for your money, they'll just laugh at you.

If it's possible in any way, part with good vibes, though that doesn't seem likely here. Good relationships are always worth the efforts, even with crooked ex-employers.

NKR 04-22-2008 01:44 PM

I understand if the companies want to protect their business. Let’s say that X works at a client place through a vendor. X’s employer has an agreement with the vendor which says that he cannot employ his employee, the vendor has an agreement with the client which says that they cannot take X through another vendor.

My question is there a validity period for these agreements beyond which it becomes invalid. A couple of years should be ok but it is frustrating to be bonded to some employer for years because one doesn’t have freedom to move around and be with the same client.

JA1HIND 04-22-2008 02:29 PM

of course it is desi
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by pointlesswait (Post 241345)
File a BBB case..but make sure you are absolutely sure Company is at fault...if its just money..
i guess u have to take a "hit".. but if they have violated ur rights in any way..u should pursue all possible options of getting justice.

is that a desi consultant!
I think we need to create a site of all desi consultants and rate them.. discretely.;-)

I am sure below copied my URL will help lot of other folks who would like to know how much employer list $$ amount in their individual LCA, who is the owner of the company, how many LCA are filed from this company for that year etc...:D

in the employer field, search by "employer name" and see the magic...and once you get to the details section look for " designated_first_name" and " designated_last_name" will tell you who the owner of the company is some more details of your interest....LOL!! :p

http://www.h1b.info/lca_search.php

americandesi 04-22-2008 03:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kg318 (Post 241222)
I work for company A which sent me to client C through company B(Prefered vendor). After working with the same client for 1.5 yrs, transfered my h1b to company B(PF) due to issues with the pay with company A. Company A has deducted huge sum of money($4000) from my last months pay towards PERM filing(Still under process). Upon demanding them to reimburse my money saying that its against law, they r threatening me saying that based on non-compete agreement they will take legal action against me.
I am not actually aware of the clauses in the agreement. company B(PF) told me that it does not have any clauses in its agreement with company A prohibiting them from taking me.Though i requested company A to provide me a copy of non-compete, they said i signed with them, they haven´t. The company is located in NJ and not sure how non-competes work under NJ state law.
I am really frustated upon this blackmail and going thru lot of pressure. The amount is too big too leave and cannot afford to hire a lawyer in case they file suit based on non-compete. even if i had signed a non compete agreement how does it stand as it is conflicting the agreement which company a signed with PF sayign tht upon my termination of the emplyment with them, Pf can take me without any gap period... what can i do to get my money. they also refused to provide me with experience letter which i need for my future GC filing.
Plz give me ur valuable inputs

Restrictive employment contracts are non-enforcable, atleast in California. Here's a classic case of a H1B employee who successfully sued his employer on a restrictive employment contract and the employer was ordered to pay $215,050.61 in damages.

http://www.news.com/Body-shop-must-p..._3-256477.html

Also note that all PERM related expenses should be borne only by the employer. Refer the following link and search for "Certain Payments are Employer's Expenses under PERM" and "Employer Must Pay even with Dual Representation "

http://www.murthy.com/news/n_filrem.html

puvathoor 04-22-2008 03:28 PM

Be Bold...
 
If I were in a similar situation, I would be leaning towards taking some action so that they know that they cannot step over the rights.. If they employ a person, pay him as per the law. If they decide to file for GC, then the employer needs to pay for it, per the law.

The problem with walking down the slippery slope of being amicable is that the boldness to stand up for the right thing also starts slipping away.

I like the idea of writing a letter and reminding them of the law. Even if you might not gain (forget the $4Gs for a sec), you will be making the path better for everyone behind you. And that, my friend, is an excellent thing.

vinabath 04-22-2008 04:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gravitation (Post 241703)
Non-compete are notoriously hard to implement.


Only if it is too restrictive. this case is pretty straightforward and simple. employee is directly hitting the employer's revenues.

gc4me 04-22-2008 04:53 PM

Miss obviously,
either you have a chicken heart or you are a silent partner of a blood s#$king deshi consulting.
kg318, this is your money and you earned it. Don't give these suckers any option to suck your earned money. Charging for GC process in any stage is totally illegal no matter which state you are from. It is DOL and USCIS policy not of a state.

I see some people trying to talk here in favour of employers straight or some times using curves. Remember kg318, there are members here who have consulting company ties and who here talks for them as well. Be judgmental.

Quote:

Originally Posted by obviously (Post 241337)
kg318... from your initial post you indicated that you "demanded" money back and noted that Company A's practice was "against the law". Now, they are using the same law against you. Not saying it is fair or pretty. Just remember, what you sow, you shall reap.

It is generally poor practice to go for gung-ho activism in a situation where you are unclear about the law (e.g., non compete) and unable to get good counsel (e.g. immigration and business law attorneys).

Just keep this in mind. Long term, your peace of mind is worth more than $4K ... just think if there are other ways in which you could have handled this.... in case such event pop up again.

If I were you, I would have a civil conversation with that company. Tell them that economics took over empathy, that you wish to be in a position where you have less financial loss and would appreciate an amicable parting of ways.
It's a small world out there. Dont pi*s on anyone, lest it come back to wet your backside!

Sabre rattling might get you out of this one, but the world still remains a small place!


kg318 04-22-2008 06:13 PM

threatening others as well.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by nitkad (Post 241700)
As far as I know this is a genuine company and not a typical small desi company.
Did you sign some paper saying that you will reimburse the GC costs if you leave the company? If it was signed before the GC process started then it is not against the law that the company is holding back the $4K. This is a big company and I don't think the $4k matters to them much.

As far as experience letter, they have to give it.

Also, sometimes we get mad at the company even though its our own mistake. So, before filling anything with the labor department, make sure you have not signed the papers. By reporting them you are basically giving trouble to others who are in GC process through them.

i haven't signed anything related to GC filing. even it came as a surprise to me that the company is making such a big fuss for the matter of $4000. And recently came to know that its not just me but there are several other consultants being harassed by them upon leaving the company. Even after years of working with them, they still want to have them hooked and are depriving the cosultants of better living. how justified is that????

kg318 04-22-2008 06:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vinabath (Post 241782)
Only if it is too restrictive. this case is pretty straightforward and simple. employee is directly hitting the employer's revenues.

I am not hitting on employers revenues, infact employer made money since two yrs because of me. The reason is, employer never got this project for me. It never had any business either with PF or with the client earlier. It was only because of my contact with the PF i got the project. i introduced the PF to my employer, have them sign a contract and since these two yrs my employer was able to place 4-5 consultants through the PF i introduced to them. Now tell me, how much my employer would have made because of me or other consultants??? Even after all this, he is being mean to me. these desi companies thirst for money is never ending. whereas consulatnts can never look up for a better life!!!!!!

kshitijnt 04-22-2008 09:06 PM

here is what to do
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by kg318 (Post 241863)
I am not hitting on employers revenues, infact employer made money since two yrs because of me. The reason is, employer never got this project for me. It never had any business either with PF or with the client earlier. It was only because of my contact with the PF i got the project. i introduced the PF to my employer, have them sign a contract and since these two yrs my employer was able to place 4-5 consultants through the PF i introduced to them. Now tell me, how much my employer would have made because of me or other consultants??? Even after all this, he is being mean to me. these desi companies thirst for money is never ending. whereas consulatnts can never look up for a better life!!!!!!


After reading this post completely, here is my take. There are 2 things to view here:
1) employer and employee conduct.
2) non compete.

employee by leaving his job to work for PF has actually worked in unethical way if not illegal. You should have joined the PF to start with. Second thing is, you said your PERM is in process. How long ago did you file it? If you filed it more than 6 months ago, maybe you didnt know you were going to leave. Did you file it very recently despite knowing that you may join PF? In that case why you wasted your employers money? Also who picked the fight? You or employer? See... if the case goes to the court, the judge is going to notice this behaviour and will not like it. I am not saying you are a bad guy, we all make mistakes like this, but in court of law everyone is equal.

employer is not only unethical but also unprofessional in holding back employee wages. It does not matter when or with what intention the employee left, employers should not be breaking the law by withholding wages.

Since both sides have made some mistakes, I suggest get a good attorney. That attorney will negotiate with your employer and you will get your money, experience letter and also attorney expenses. There is no need to involve your PF at this stage. Your employer has a relationship with that company and that is the reason they do not want to go to court. However if you conduct yourself in unethical or unprofessional way, your previous employer can indicate that to your current company and that is a bad career move. Your case is very simple and it will be settled out of court. I would say, you do not get involved and commit mistakes under stress, let an attorney handle it.

Lastly, if you consult an attorney, any good attorney should tell you 2 things:
1) you have advantage over employer because employer has withheld your wages which is illegal as they have violated statutes for PERM.
2) It also depends on your non compete, you dont know what you signed. It may not be directly related to GC expense or direct revenue loss, but it may be something that your employer can hold you accountable.

I think your employer is just mad that you left them on unpleasant terms. Here is what I recommend:

1) Send an email, and offer to apologize if any of your actions left the employer less than satisfied. "DO NOT explicitly admit to mistakes. But offer a sincere apology if that can close the matter." Highlight, what you have done for the company, including placing 4 employees, working for 2 years etc. Regret that you had to leave despite filing perm with them and say you will be willing to help in future. Then call your boss. ask for his help. If he doesnt pick up, doesnt matter, leave a VM. However much you dont like doing it. It is necessary to do so. World is a small place and never burn bridges. Also mention in email you would like to get $4K back and experience letter. I will say copy HR, your boss and his boss. etc. The more higher levels you keep in loop, more people become answerable in court of law. If you copy VP etc of your group, if you decide to go court they can be called in as witnesses. They do not want this. No company wants to put their senior executives/managers in cross examinations in court. They know you can sue them, however do not use such language as the judge will not like it and in all probability he will ask you what you did in good faith to get your wage back? And any shouting , calling names etc will count against you for getting any damages.

2) give them 2 weeks to reply. Consult a lawyer, a good lawyer is one who also tells you what was your fault. No lawyer will tell you what you want to hear. All lawyers will tell you to conduct in ethical and professional manner. You know they are representing you. Their reputation is based on merit of your case.

3) if they dont respond in 2 weeks, file a claim in small claims court. serve a notice. In small claims court attorneys are not allowed to practise. If you win, ask the judge to award you maximum penalty allowed under the law. Also mention you want to get it in one payment. This becomes a public record against the company for anyone to see. I dont think any company wants so much hassle for 4K.

Gravitation 04-22-2008 09:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vinabath (Post 241782)
Only if it is too restrictive. this case is pretty straightforward and simple. employee is directly hitting the employer's revenues.

That means nothing in the court actually. It takes a lot more such as violation of trade-secrets for a court to rule against an employee. If hitting revenue was a valid reason not to change a job, nobody will ever be able to change a job.

What you mention is a common misconception.

"In Virginia, a plaintiff must prove by a preponderance of the evidence that the covenant is reasonable in the sense that it is: (1) no greater than necessary to protect its legitimate business interests, such as a trade secret; (2) not unduly harsh or oppressive in restricting the employee’s ability to earn a living; and (3) not against public policy."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-compete_clause

kg318 04-22-2008 10:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kshitijnt (Post 241913)
After reading this post completely, here is my take. There are 2 things to view here:
1) employer and employee conduct.
2) non compete.

employee by leaving his job to work for PF has actually worked in unethical way if not illegal. You should have joined the PF to start with. Second thing is, you said your PERM is in process. How long ago did you file it? If you filed it more than 6 months ago, maybe you didnt know you were going to leave. Did you file it very recently despite knowing that you may join PF? In that case why you wasted your employers money? Also who picked the fight? You or employer? See... if the case goes to the court, the judge is going to notice this behaviour and will not like it. I am not saying you are a bad guy, we all make mistakes like this, but in court of law everyone is equal.

employer is not only unethical but also unprofessional in holding back employee wages. It does not matter when or with what intention the employee left, employers should not be breaking the law by withholding wages.

Since both sides have made some mistakes, I suggest get a good attorney. That attorney will negotiate with your employer and you will get your money, experience letter and also attorney expenses. There is no need to involve your PF at this stage. Your employer has a relationship with that company and that is the reason they do not want to go to court. However if you conduct yourself in unethical or unprofessional way, your previous employer can indicate that to your current company and that is a bad career move. Your case is very simple and it will be settled out of court. I would say, you do not get involved and commit mistakes under stress, let an attorney handle it.

Lastly, if you consult an attorney, any good attorney should tell you 2 things:
1) you have advantage over employer because employer has withheld your wages which is illegal as they have violated statutes for PERM.
2) It also depends on your non compete, you dont know what you signed. It may not be directly related to GC expense or direct revenue loss, but it may be something that your employer can hold you accountable.

I think your employer is just mad that you left them on unpleasant terms. Here is what I recommend:

1) Send an email, and offer to apologize if any of your actions left the employer less than satisfied. "DO NOT explicitly admit to mistakes. But offer a sincere apology if that can close the matter." Highlight, what you have done for the company, including placing 4 employees, working for 2 years etc. Regret that you had to leave despite filing perm with them and say you will be willing to help in future. Then call your boss. ask for his help. If he doesnt pick up, doesnt matter, leave a VM. However much you dont like doing it. It is necessary to do so. World is a small place and never burn bridges. Also mention in email you would like to get $4K back and experience letter. I will say copy HR, your boss and his boss. etc. The more higher levels you keep in loop, more people become answerable in court of law. If you copy VP etc of your group, if you decide to go court they can be called in as witnesses. They do not want this. No company wants to put their senior executives/managers in cross examinations in court. They know you can sue them, however do not use such language as the judge will not like it and in all probability he will ask you what you did in good faith to get your wage back? And any shouting , calling names etc will count against you for getting any damages.

2) give them 2 weeks to reply. Consult a lawyer, a good lawyer is one who also tells you what was your fault. No lawyer will tell you what you want to hear. All lawyers will tell you to conduct in ethical and professional manner. You know they are representing you. Their reputation is based on merit of your case.

3) if they dont respond in 2 weeks, file a claim in small claims court. serve a notice. In small claims court attorneys are not allowed to practise. If you win, ask the judge to award you maximum penalty allowed under the law. Also mention you want to get it in one payment. This becomes a public record against the company for anyone to see. I dont think any company wants so much hassle for 4K.



thanks a lot kshitijnt.... my gc has been filed about 5 months back. At that point I wasn't planning to shift to PF otherwise i wudn't have made them file it. ya, as u said i shud have started with PF directy. Just because my company filed for h1b, i didn't wanted to ditch theem. Now I realised that its foolish in this fied to be considerate for someone especially desi employers.
Anyways will try ur way and see how it goes.

vinabath 04-23-2008 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kg318 (Post 241863)
I am not hitting on employers revenues, infact employer made money since two yrs because of me. The reason is, employer never got this project for me. It never had any business either with PF or with the client earlier. It was only because of my contact with the PF i got the project. i introduced the PF to my employer, have them sign a contract and since these two yrs my employer was able to place 4-5 consultants through the PF i introduced to them. Now tell me, how much my employer would have made because of me or other consultants??? Even after all this, he is being mean to me. these desi companies thirst for money is never ending. whereas consulatnts can never look up for a better life!!!!!!

You have a case buddy. Since you got the project on your own and you needed an H-1b vehicle. you have a great argument if your employer goes to the court.

vinabath 04-23-2008 10:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kg318 (Post 241936)
thanks a lot kshitijnt.... my gc has been filed about 5 months back. At that point I wasn't planning to shift to PF otherwise i wudn't have made them file it. ya, as u said i shud have started with PF directy. Just because my company filed for h1b, i didn't wanted to ditch theem. Now I realised that its foolish in this fied to be considerate for someone especially desi employers.
Anyways will try ur way and see how it goes.


nice post by 'kshitijnt'.

aquarianf 04-23-2008 01:21 PM

do not follow the advice of many members in this thread
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by kg318 (Post 241222)
I work for company A which sent me to client C through company B(Prefered vendor). After working with the same client for 1.5 yrs, transfered my h1b to company B(PF) due to issues with the pay with company A. Company A has deducted huge sum of money($4000) from my last months pay towards PERM filing(Still under process). Upon demanding them to reimburse my money saying that its against law, they r threatening me saying that based on non-compete agreement they will take legal action against me.
I am not actually aware of the clauses in the agreement. company B(PF) told me that it does not have any clauses in its agreement with company A prohibiting them from taking me.Though i requested company A to provide me a copy of non-compete, they said i signed with them, they haven´t. The company is located in NJ and not sure how non-competes work under NJ state law.
I am really frustated upon this blackmail and going thru lot of pressure. The amount is too big too leave and cannot afford to hire a lawyer in case they file suit based on non-compete. even if i had signed a non compete agreement how does it stand as it is conflicting the agreement which company a signed with PF saying the upon my termination of the emplyment with them, Pf can take me without any gap period... what can i do to get my money. they also refused to provide me with experience letter which i need for my future GC filing.
Plz give me ur valuable inputs

I just read first page of this thread and would advice that don't follow most of reply because they are lawyers or they have not gone through the experience you are going through. $4000 may not be big amount compared to hassle of law suite , piece of mind or the amount of increase you may have received by switching employer. I know a close person who had gone through exactly same situation in NJ and had to pay 12,000 to settle the case. I have seen bunch of people in same situation and my friend always adviced them to stay away from law suite. If your current employer is not big then there are greater chances that it will turn away from you in case of law suite.

If you are not working with same client that you were working when you were in company A then non-compete may not hold against you.

Also can you get in writing from you current employer that they will support you in case of law suite?

NKR 04-23-2008 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aquarianf (Post 242079)
I just read first page of this thread and would advice that don't follow most of reply because they are lawyers or they have not gone through the experience you are going through. $4000 may not be big amount compared to hassle of law suite , piece of mind or the amount of increase you may have received by switching employer. I know a close person who had gone through exactly same situation in NJ and had to pay 12,000 to settle the case. I have seen bunch of people in same situation and my friend always adviced them to stay away from law suite. If your current employer is not big then there are greater chances that it will turn away from you in case of law suite.

If you are not working with same client that you were working when you were in company A then non-compete may not hold against you.

Also can you get in writing from you current employer that they will support you in case of law suite?

Are you an desi employer by any chance?. Just wondering…

Also I agree with most of what kshitijnt says but why should somebody apologize even after he has placed 4 employees and has worked for 2 years. He did not leave within couple of months for crying out loud. Some of the desi employers are so greedy and unethical that even after you slog with them for years, they still want to hold on to something just to prove they are employer/boss. This is a lesson for people wanting to help their employers business. I would tell them that it is none of their business to help their employer’s business.

Omm 04-23-2008 02:52 PM

Absolutely right!!
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by NKR (Post 242094)
Are you an desi employer by any chance?. Just wondering…

Also I agree with most of what kshitijnt says but why should somebody apologize even after he has placed 4 employees and has worked for 2 years. He did not leave within couple of months for crying out loud. Some of the desi employers are so greedy and unethical that even after you slog with them for years, they still want to hold on to something just to prove they are employer/boss. This is a lesson for people wanting to help their employers business. I would tell them that it is none of their business to help their employer’s business.



Yes I agree with you, Some are really nastly dont give anything in writting , Dont even apply for H1b until you force them when they hire you on OPT, I have seen some of my freinds had to go back to India because of them. They are to be taugh a lesson, If we are immigants they are too.

kg318 04-23-2008 03:35 PM

issue not yet resolved
 
hi all,

Thanks a lot for all ur suggestions and support. As of now, nothing is moving on in my issue. The last correpondence with the employer was only when i sent mail asking for my money and got reply saying that they will contact their attorney to see what legal action they can take using non compete agreement. But till today, its calm and they are not replying to any of my mails or calls. I feel like its just a mail to scare me......took an appointment with attorney to discuss this and be geared up for action........

raj2007 04-23-2008 03:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kg318 (Post 242141)
hi all,

Thanks a lot for all ur suggestions and support. As of now, nothing is moving on in my issue. The last correpondence with the employer was only when i sent mail asking for my money and got reply saying that they will contact their attorney to see what legal action they can take using non compete agreement. But till today, its calm and they are not replying to any of my mails or calls. I feel like its just a mail to scare me......took an appointment with attorney to discuss this and be geared up for action........

Your case is not very clear..How can attroney can advice without reviewing the non-compete agreement?

Non-compete Agreements in New Jersey

Should you sign that non-compete agreement?

It has become fashionable for employers of all types and sizes to require their employees to sign non-compete agreements. These agreements range from very narrow to very broad in scope. A non-compete may bar you from working for a competitor, using or disclosing trade secrets or other confidential information, soliciting customers or recruiting the your employer’s customers. These restrictions generally last from a few months to a few years. Because signing such an agreement can severely restrict your future employment options, you (and your attorney) should review it closely before doing so.

Can you be fired for refusing to sign that non-compete agreement?

Yes, according to the Supreme Court of New Jersey. See Maw v. Advanced Clinical Communications, 179 N.J. 439 (2004).

Will a New Jersey court enforce your non-compete agreement?

Do not make the mistake of thinking that you can sign an agreement and ignore it later. New Jersey Courts routinely enforce non-compete agreements that are “reasonable” in scope. A non-compete agreement will generally be considered reasonable if it (1) protects the legitimate interests of the employer; (2) does not impose an undue hardship on the employee; and (3) is not injurious to the public.

What will happen if you have signed a non-compete agreement that is not “reasonable”?

If the geographic and temporal restrictions in your non-compete agreement exceed the boundaries necessary to protect your employer, a New Jersey court may modify the agreement by reducing those restrictions to make the agreement reasonable. See Solari Industries v. Malady, 55 N.J. 571 (1970).


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:00 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
(c)ImmigrationVoice.org