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  #46 (permalink)  
Old 06-28-2009, 11:11 PM
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by h1techSlave View Post
Employers can (at least they do) discriminate EAD holders. Here is an example and related link:
Fog Creek Software - Intern in Software Development

"Permanent legal right to work in the United States. Because student visas (J1, F1, etc) are time-limited, we regret that we can't consider interns on student visas."


They key word here is "Permanent legal right to work in the United States". EADs (485 based EAD as well as F1 based EADs) have a limit of 1 year/2 year/29 months etc. Based on this Fog Creek Software will not hire an EAD holder. Can we do some thing about this blatant violation of the law?

As per I-9 form
Quote:
The refusal to hire an individual because the documents presented have a future expiration date may also constitute illegal discrimination.
Any person wrongly discriminated due to EAD expiration date has the option of seeking claims for damages caused by the other party in court of law. I am not aware of any case involving such facts.


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Last edited by desi3933; 06-28-2009 at 11:14 PM.
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  #47 (permalink)  
Old 06-28-2009, 11:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by walking_dude View Post
A note to my fellow IV members - I am not after the $42/Hr job. Good luck in finding a US citizen to do this job. I was wrong about EEO, it is actually IRCA which prohibits discrimination in recruitment and hiring.

Best Practices for hiring workers from Department of Justice

But the point remains - visa status based discrimination is illegal not matter which law is being violated, and must be highlighted. We have to correct the misinformation spread by anti-immigrant groups that most jobs are "reserved for H1Bs", while the reality is different. Most jobs are "reserved" for American workers (although such reservation is illegal under IRCA). We have to provide the proof that the myth of "thousands of jobs reserved for foreign workers" in nothing but a myth. My posting is a small step in that direction.

Here is another one in the continuing series of exposing the highly prevalent illegal hiring practice. I request everyone to start posting similar job-ads you get from recruiters. Once we get a hundred or more ads here, we can start E-mailing the links to the media.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

fromPatricia (Vyshnavi Infotech) <patricia@vysinc.com>
to"Patricia (Vyshnavi Infotech)" <patricia@vysinc.com>

dateMon, Jun 1, 2009 at 12:56 PM
subjectJobs for Web logic consultants


HI,

This is Patricia Evan. I have the below position for one of my clients. If you are interested in this position please send me your updated resume.

Web logic Java Consultant

Duration is 6 months.
Location is Connecticut

Must be US Citizen

Looking for a Weblogic Java Consultant with strong pharmaceutical experience
this person will be building webpage’s and build controls to access database Page flow development for a portal that supports my clients clinical trial tracking process. This internal/external portal
allows documents to be accessed and uploaded, etc.

The successful candidates should have the skills mentioned below and also know how to debug problems, how to configure into weblog console, and query a database to join tables. Client will teach the business processes.

Must Haves:
Deep development skills
Weblogic Admin tool 10.2
Apache Beehive Page Flow
Database controls
Java/JSP
Strong SQL
Oracle 10G (preferred)
AJAX
Java Script

Candidate must have all of above….strong Apache Beehive Page Flow is key to position.



Regards,
Patricia Evan
IT Recruiter
Vyshnavi Infotech INC
Herndon, VA 20170
PH : 703-793-1868 Ext 211
Fax: 703-547-0135
Emailatricia@vysinc.com
vivek - I have come across this company. It is a desi consulting company. The "Reqruiter" name seems to be a "nickname". Looks like they are doing these things so that they do not fall under the radar and hence such blatent statements "Only US Citizen".

If we all remember there was another post on dice which said "No Indians" and was discussed a lot on IV and finally the reqruiter got fired.

Looks like desi companies are trying to seek a new identity so that they do not fall under the radar
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  #48 (permalink)  
Old 06-29-2009, 08:58 AM
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Default I have provided you an example of discrimination

The link in my earlier post is a job advertisement which clearly states that EAD folks need not apply. There are 1000s of folks out there who are eligible for that position, but for the EAD restriction.

Quote:
Originally Posted by desi3933 View Post
As per I-9 form
Any person wrongly discriminated due to EAD expiration date has the option of seeking claims for damages caused by the other party in court of law. I am not aware of any case involving such facts.


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  #49 (permalink)  
Old 06-29-2009, 09:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by h1techSlave View Post
The link in my earlier post is a job advertisement which clearly states that EAD folks need not apply. There are 1000s of folks out there who are eligible for that position, but for the EAD restriction.
My question is -
what are these "1000s of folks" doing? Are they waiting for someone else to work for their cause?

If they believe they were wronged, they need to take action. Without any action, nothing is going to happen.

And, yes, these is discrimination on the both side of the lines. Have you looked at the hiring practices of leading desi outsourcing/consulting companies in the US?


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  #50 (permalink)  
Old 06-29-2009, 10:07 AM
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Default Discrimination based on Immigration status: Complaint to Special Counsel

Quote:
Originally Posted by desi3933 View Post
My question is -
what are these "1000s of folks" doing? Are they waiting for someone else to work for their cause?

If they believe they were wronged, they need to take action. Without any action, nothing is going to happen.

And, yes, these is discrimination on the both side of the lines. Have you looked at the hiring practices of leading desi outsourcing/consulting companies in the US?


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Here is the contact info for registering a complaint.

Office of Special Counsel for Immigration Related Unfair Employment Practices

Office of Special Counsel Contact List
Through a language interpreter service, we are equipped to assist callers in all languages.
Mailing Address:
U.S. Department of Justice
Civil Rights Division
Office of Special Counsel for Immigration-Related
Unfair Employment Practices
950 Pennsylvania Avenue, N.W.
Washington, D.C. 20530
Main Number: (202) 616-5594
Fax Number: (202) 616-5509
Toll Free Information Number and Worker Hotline: 1-800-255-7688
(202) 616-5525 or 1-800-237-2515 (TDD for hearing impaired)
Employer Hotline: 1-800-255-8155
1-800-237-2515 (TDD for hearing impaired)
E-mail Address: osccrt@usdoj.gov. We will make every effort to respond to emails that relate to the work of this office within 30 days. However, for immediate assistance, please call our employer hotline (1-800-255-8155) or worker hotline (1-800-255-7688).
Web Address: Office of Special Counsel for Immigration-Related Unfair Employment Practices (OSC) -- Home Page
Special Counsel
Vacant
Deputy Special Counsel
Katherine A. Baldwin
Special Policy Counsel
Margaret Hu
Special Litigation Counsel
Robin M. Stutman
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  #51 (permalink)  
Old 06-29-2009, 11:43 AM
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Default EAD folks are doing nothing

The answer to your question is: Nothing. They may be waiting, because of many reasons like, they are scared, do not care, there are other opportunities, tired of this immigration crap, lack of enough knowledge regarding their rights.

Now, I do not think the onus correcting such mistakes is 100% on the EAD folks' shoulders. I remember reading how slavery ended in this country. Slavery died, not because the black people fought for the abolition of slavery; slavery ended when the white man realized that slavery is wrong.

Based on the same logic, I would say that the job of stopping discrimination against EAD/H1B etc. is mainly the responsibility of Citizens and GC holders. It is their country; it is up to them to fix it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by desi3933 View Post
My question is -
what are these "1000s of folks" doing? Are they waiting for someone else to work for their cause?

If they believe they were wronged, they need to take action. Without any action, nothing is going to happen.

And, yes, these is discrimination on the both side of the lines. Have you looked at the hiring practices of leading desi outsourcing/consulting companies in the US?


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  #52 (permalink)  
Old 06-29-2009, 12:41 PM
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by h1techSlave View Post
.....
Based on the same logic, I would say that the job of stopping discrimination against EAD/H1B etc. is mainly the responsibility of Citizens and GC holders. It is their country; it is up to them to fix it.
There are laws in place, already, for discrimination against applicant having proper work authorization.

If the affected person does not report or take action, then nothing will happen. It is high time that "highly skilled workers" aware of their rights. Sanju mentioned a term "educated illiterates" for such reasons.

Many consulting companies do not pay salary on bench. If the employee does not report to DoL, will he/she get his/her salary? No. The issue of discrimination is on the similar lines.

There is no requirement for employer to consider any applicant who is on H-1B visa status. It is entirely voluntary and upto the employer whether to sponsor H1 visa or not. Same thing holds good for sponsoring green card as well.



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  #53 (permalink)  
Old 07-08-2009, 10:30 AM
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Default On more ad for a fortune 100 co.

Sub :Vignette Portal Developer - Java/Tibco - Fortune 100 Co

07/07/2009


Where: Washington D.C.
Length: 1+ year
Rate: $75-80/hour (all-inclusive and must be onsite)

*MUST BE A U.S. CITIZEN!!*

*HOT AND IMMEDIATE NEED!*

Job Spec:

Looking for a strong Vignette Portal Developer with extensive Java experience. Knowledge of Middleware with integrating others COTS applications.

If you, or someone you may know (excellent referral bonus!!) is qualified and interested, please dont hesitate to contact me at yrozmaryn@itmmi.com

Thanks again.

Yair Rozmaryn
Mitchell/Martin, Inc.
307 West 38th Street, Suite 1305
New York, NY 10018
yrozmaryn@itmmi.com



MMI Ranked Among Top 50 Growing Staffing Firms by Staffing Analysts 2006
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  #54 (permalink)  
Old 07-08-2009, 10:35 AM
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Default

Folks have you noticed the options on dice when you have to fill up your profile. makes you choose if you are EAD or GC or Citizen or h1b or any other. Now, does it not create a situation where employers can filter you?

In all other websites like Monster, hotjobs etc... the choices are
(1) Authorized to work for any employer
(2) Authorized to work for currrent employer
.....
.....
which makes more sense.

Has anyone noticed this?
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  #55 (permalink)  
Old 07-08-2009, 10:56 AM
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by desi3933 View Post
There are laws in place, already, for discrimination against applicant having proper work authorization.

If the affected person does not report or take action, then nothing will happen. It is high time that "highly skilled workers" aware of their rights. Sanju mentioned a term "educated illiterates" for such reasons.

Many consulting companies do not pay salary on bench. If the employee does not report to DoL, will he/she get his/her salary? No. The issue of discrimination is on the similar lines.

There is no requirement for employer to consider any applicant who is on H-1B visa status. It is entirely voluntary and upto the employer whether to sponsor H1 visa or not. Same thing holds good for sponsoring green card as well.



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desi - the reason we face all these issues is not because of anyone's fault.
Reporting an employer is not as easy as it sounds.
The most educated and experienced people have always recommended to "protect yourself" - look for yourself and keep out of trouble.
The issue here is - people in this situation are mere scapegoats - a common man who approaches beaucracy has to deal with crap that is worse.

The entire process of immigrating to US via a employment based system is so loosely organized and puts people in unfair situations.

It is just not desi employers or consulting companies, in general, but any employer can have an upper hand on you when you are at their mercy.

People say big companies have policies and they abide. I agree, but it is not always the case. If someone is in business - they do things in their business interest - if dealing with USCIS is getting difficult - they may say "enough of it - no more responding to RFEs".

One person contacted me - he is having a fulltime job and filed for AC21. he got RFE for EVL 2 times. The first time his HR gave EVL without any hasstles, the second time she was pissed, said "We do not want to deal with this - I have contacted legal and they recommend not to issue such letters".

Now such a situation puts this person in a tough spot -the issue is not because of his employer because his employer did give a proper letter but USCIS asked it again.

Just imagine what is this person's situation for no fault of his?

We can always argue that "If you are worth and if company wants to retain you then they will not have any issues" - which once again may not always be true because we all know how relationships work out at companies - with ass kissing, nepotism, situations, financial etc......
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  #56 (permalink)  
Old 07-08-2009, 11:07 AM
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Default Well said

Quote:
Originally Posted by chanduv23 View Post
desi - the reason we face all these issues is not because of anyone's fault.
Reporting an employer is not as easy as it sounds.
The most educated and experienced people have always recommended to "protect yourself" - look for yourself and keep out of trouble.
The issue here is - people in this situation are mere scapegoats - a common man who approaches beaucracy has to deal with crap that is worse.

The entire process of immigrating to US via a employment based system is so loosely organized and puts people in unfair situations.

It is just not desi employers or consulting companies, in general, but any employer can have an upper hand on you when you are at their mercy.

People say big companies have policies and they abide. I agree, but it is not always the case. If someone is in business - they do things in their business interest - if dealing with USCIS is getting difficult - they may say "enough of it - no more responding to RFEs".

One person contacted me - he is having a fulltime job and filed for AC21. he got RFE for EVL 2 times. The first time his HR gave EVL without any hasstles, the second time she was pissed, said "We do not want to deal with this - I have contacted legal and they recommend not to issue such letters".

Now such a situation puts this person in a tough spot -the issue is not because of his employer because his employer did give a proper letter but USCIS asked it again.

Just imagine what is this person's situation for no fault of his?

We can always argue that "If you are worth and if company wants to retain you then they will not have any issues" - which once again may not always be true because we all know how relationships work out at companies - with ass kissing, nepotism, situations, financial etc......
This is very true. People may want to come forward and complain about employes but is there clear guidence on what will be status of employee if employer withdraw her/his h1b ?
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  #57 (permalink)  
Old 07-08-2009, 11:22 AM
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by gc_on_demand View Post
This is very true. People may want to come forward and complain about employes but is there clear guidence on what will be status of employee if employer withdraw her/his h1b ?
Employer can not retaliate against employee just because he/she exercised his/her legal rights as an employee.

http://www.osha.gov/OshDoc/data_Gene...wer_rights.pdf

Infact, if one has reported against Employer against no pay on bench, even USCIS considers the employee in status as his/her out-of-status was out of his/her control and he/she taken action available to him/her.

I undertsand, laws are very complex and one needs to be like a Chanakya to get even with big players.


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  #58 (permalink)  
Old 07-08-2009, 11:45 AM
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Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by chanduv23 View Post
The entire process of immigrating to US via a employment based system is so loosely organized and puts people in unfair situations.
I agree. Since Employment based immigration is driven by Employer needs, employer has the bigger say.

Quote:
Originally Posted by chanduv23 View Post
It is just not desi employers or consulting companies, in general, but any employer can have an upper hand on you when you are at their mercy.
Since the process is driven by Employer needs, whole immigration process depends on it. Is it fair from employee point of view? Most likely, not. But, thats how current laws are in place. Changing these laws are not easy, to say the least.

Quote:
Originally Posted by chanduv23 View Post
People say big companies have policies and they abide. I agree, but it is not always the case. If someone is in business - they do things in their business interest - if dealing with USCIS is getting difficult - they may say "enough of it - no more responding to RFEs".

One person contacted me - he is having a fulltime job and filed for AC21. he got RFE for EVL 2 times. The first time his HR gave EVL without any hasstles, the second time she was pissed, said "We do not want to deal with this - I have contacted legal and they recommend not to issue such letters".

Now such a situation puts this person in a tough spot -the issue is not because of his employer because his employer did give a proper letter but USCIS asked it again.

Just imagine what is this person's situation for no fault of his?
This is really a very unfortunate situation.

The big difference between EAD (for AC-21) and GC is that AC-21 employer has to provide supporting EVL document to continue pending I-485. Now, it is upto the applicant how he/she passes this information to the employer when he/she joins that AC-21 job.

Now, many would pass clear info to AC21 employer that they would EVL to support their GC process (I-485) and no other sponsorship is required. Now, its upto their mutual agreement on EVL. Employer is, within his rights, not to support or issue AC-21 EVL letter.

On the practical side, vast majority of employer have no issues with such EVL letters.

Big companies, of course, go with their legal team recommendation as their main purpose to run their business with least legal hassels.

Quote:
Originally Posted by chanduv23 View Post
We can always argue that "If you are worth and if company wants to retain you then they will not have any issues" - which once again may not always be true because we all know how relationships work out at companies - with ass kissing, nepotism, situations, financial etc......
It is two-way street. If employer is really good, employee will make extra effort on his job. IF employee is valuable (from employer's point of view), most employer will go extra mile to retain him/her. I have seen many such incidents in 12+ years of professional career.

There is, of course, work politics involved too. Bitching about co-worker, a$$ kissing, nepotism is part of it.

I have seen cases, where one team member is making 115k and another team member, at same role, is making just 85k. This may be unfair, but legal.

---------------
Life is not fair; get used to it. - Bill Gates

Success is a lousy teacher. It seduces smart people into thinking they can't lose. - Bill Gates


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  #59 (permalink)  
Old 07-08-2009, 12:11 PM
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Where is Moira from Buisnessweek?

Why can't she cover this?
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Old 07-08-2009, 12:23 PM
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Originally Posted by desi3933 View Post
I agree. Since Employment based immigration is driven by Employer needs, employer has the bigger say.



Since the process is driven by Employer needs, whole immigration process depends on it. Is it fair from employee point of view? Most likely, not. But, thats how current laws are in place. Changing these laws are not easy, to say the least.



This is really a very unfortunate situation.

The big difference between EAD (for AC-21) and GC is that AC-21 employer has to provide supporting EVL document to continue pending I-485. Now, it is upto the applicant how he/she passes this information to the employer when he/she joins that AC-21 job.

Now, many would pass clear info to AC21 employer that they would EVL to support their GC process (I-485) and no other sponsorship is required. Now, its upto their mutual agreement on EVL. Employer is, within his rights, not to support or issue AC-21 EVL letter.

On the practical side, vast majority of employer have no issues with such EVL letters.

Big companies, of course, go with their legal team recommendation as their main purpose to run their business with least legal hassels.



It is two-way street. If employer is really good, employee will make extra effort on his job. IF employee is valuable (from employer's point of view), most employer will go extra mile to retain him/her. I have seen many such incidents in 12+ years of professional career.

There is, of course, work politics involved too. Bitching about co-worker, a$$ kissing, nepotism is part of it.

I have seen cases, where one team member is making 115k and another team member, at same role, is making just 85k. This may be unfair, but legal.

---------------
Life is not fair; get used to it. - Bill Gates

Success is a lousy teacher. It seduces smart people into thinking they can't lose. - Bill Gates


.
Your perspectives go well beyond what an average immigrant thinks about the whole EB system.

I have seen people "NOT" being themselves and do everything at workplace ONLY because their GC is pending and they do not want to have issues with employer for the sake of GC.

In my opinion, which also complements urs, the whole employment thing - if viewed from the eyes of a common man - one whose immigration status is not tied up with employer, is completely different.

I have seen people facing cultural issues, community issues and a wide range of issues - such things get masked when one's focus is on the GC process, heck leave alone GC - people struggle for even getting h1b and maintaining it.

A lot of people I talk to who come fresh out of school or have 2 years of experience or so, think that they have certain skills and employers would not live without them - whereas it is THEIR struggle to maintain h1b and also work towards GC on long run. All this is nothing but lack of thought process that people must apply but will not because their primary aim is to work out a sponser.

I am not blaming an employee or employer for this but this entire EB based system is set up in that way.
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Greened on September 10th, 2010
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