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  #46 (permalink)  
Old 07-07-2009, 06:02 PM
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Default Half baked cookie

Moria Herbst articles are silly, they are all half baked, probably she is just behaving like the way she use to behave in her high school, jealousy. Probably passed out of college with E grades, F grades or inevitable.
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  #47 (permalink)  
Old 07-07-2009, 07:38 PM
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Your are wasting your time advising to me (and others.). We will ask you for advice when we need it. I advice you to ignore this thread just like your advice to ignore BusinessWeek. When you can ignore the racist remarks at BW, ignoring my thread should be much easier.


Quote:
Originally Posted by ronhira View Post
Do not value what this guy sends as a template response to all of us. I too got the same template response. It doesn't mean anything.

You are wasting your and others time. Why give so much attention to Business week. That magazine is not the subject. Stop this wrong message. I don't give a damn what John Byrne or any freaking racist have to say. You are doing advertisement for the Business week, which is why they wrote that article in the first place. Stop this advertisement for business week.
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  #48 (permalink)  
Old 07-07-2009, 07:45 PM
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Hopein07 you left no doubts about your dual identity when you claimed senthil1's post be the sanest in this thread. If you feel other posts are insane, stop reading them. Pactice what you preach before advising others.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hopein07 View Post
Indian media, particularly Times of India, loves to print gossip and trash. Besides, negative publicity always helps the protagonist receive more attention so Businessweek will get even more popular.
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  #49 (permalink)  
Old 07-07-2009, 07:50 PM
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This was the exact reason Nero gave for playing fiddle when the Rome burned. He thought the fire will extinguish itself with no human action required. Apaparently it did, but not before burning down the whole of Rome.

Right now it's some anonymous blogger with a website in Panama. Tomorrow it's your neighbor or the guy you meet in a subway. How long will you ignore this? Is ot until everyone around you feels emboldened to spit on your face? Please define the limits of your tolerance!

Quote:
Originally Posted by akscjun View Post
I might be wrong but here is what i think - The articles become popular based on number of times they are read and number of comments they receive.

Looking at her article comments i saw that most comments were made by h1b guys and girls. So we are in a way giving her publicity which she doesn't deserve. I will say that going forward just avoid reading the articles by her.
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  #50 (permalink)  
Old 07-07-2009, 08:06 PM
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Default Interesting...

Are you implying that what's depicted in the film - a poor and uneducated slum-dweller making it against all odds - is on par with how the term is used by the loathsome blogger on it grunt?

(Let's refrain from mentioning the blog's URL/domain name - it only helps the site's rankings in search engines...

jazz

Quote:
Originally Posted by pointlesswait View Post
Its difficult for everyone to be on our side..if our struggle.

I have sent the mail....Ignorant have to be enlightened.

Now...talking abt the article being racist.. I beg to differ...

The use of word "Slumdog" should hardly be cause of insult for us desis.. didnt we all go gaga when AR Rehman won oscar for his Slumdog Song.. didnt we all sing jai ho ..and feel good..

When we didnt oppose the movie for its "racist" title.. how can you stop someone from calling us Slumdogs..

I didnt find the article racist.. but i definitely dont agree with her....

I attended the call and i emailed my objection.

It was a good grass root effort.. we must continue our fight..

these tough times will only get uglier.. we must not lose our civility ...
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  #51 (permalink)  
Old 07-07-2009, 11:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by akscjun View Post
I might be wrong but here is what i think - The articles become popular based on number of times they are read and number of comments they receive.

Looking at her article comments i saw that most comments were made by h1b guys and girls. So we are in a way giving her publicity which she doesn't deserve. I will say that going forward just avoid reading the articles by her.
After reading this chain - i went back and read the article in question couple of times.........this article is no different in tone and nature of content than dozens of articles in other reputed magazines on other controversial topics (Iran, War on Iraq, Immigration, Abortion, Gay rights etc.) with two very passionate but opposing sets of views.

The author is not commenting on the topic per se but writing about an individual who represents one side of the debate (the academic mentioned in the article) - if we read carefully - the author neither agrees or disagrees with the viewpoint.........as to why the author has chosen to include the blogger's critique and not IV's - reflects as much on the relevance or irrelevance of IV in mainstream debate as much it does on the bias that the author may or may not have........

BW has neither endorsed nor condemned the use of the Slumdog word by the blogger - the sentence is just to add more color as to what kind of blog the person runs so readers can make up their minds whether to trust the blogger or not........

I am as much proud of my heritage as anyone else and I honestly did not find the article offensive - one sided - yes sure- but thats the author's journalistic prerogative........besides coming from a country with 5,000 years of heritage and proven greatness in many areas - if someone (the blog in question) calls me or my community any offensive names - it reflects poorly on the person who presents the views and does not in any way impact me - i have more serious issues in life to take care of.............

It would be like - if someone called Michael Jackson a rotten singer - it would show the person's stupidity not diminish Michael Jackson's reputation..........

Couple of lessons I have learned in my professional life and have stood me in good stead may be worth mentioning here:

1. Sometimes, being oversensitive to a "non-issue" shows immaturity rather than proving a point.

2. Pick the battles one wants to fight very carefully - we have limited armor and weapons- use with discretion......
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  #52 (permalink)  
Old 07-08-2009, 02:08 AM
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Dear Holier-than-thou sayantan who hasn't contributed anything to the community,

I tried to make sense of your comment, which may or may not be there in our comment, which you may or may not have made, considering the fact that IV members may or may not heed your - may or may not be- useful advice. That's entirely their prerogative.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Seriously guys, when we don't need advice from these pseudo-intellectuals who haven't contributed anything [donations and otherwise] to the community, it keeps pouring in.



Quote:
Originally Posted by sayantan76 View Post
<sniff>
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  #53 (permalink)  
Old 07-08-2009, 09:19 AM
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sayantan76's comments maybe ideologically correct. The author might have written neither supporting/nor opposing anti-immigrants view. However the perception of an article written favoring anti-immigrants/racist in Business Week do hurt our cause.

It is not about whether the "S" word hurt us personally, the issue is "is the article hurting our interests".

Regarding the merits of the article, does copy-pasting somebody else's view without contributing one's own thought process into the article make a journalist ? An anti-immigrant could have written that article themselves. Why does Business Week need a "journalist" like Moira to do that job ?
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  #54 (permalink)  
Old 07-08-2009, 09:26 AM
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moira is vindictive and so he is a bad bad person. because some of us wrote to his boss, he is now writing bad articles about employer exploitation - making sure that to make it appear us like slumdogs. its just tells us that he is not only a racist jounalist but a bad person.
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  #55 (permalink)  
Old 07-08-2009, 10:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ronhira View Post
moira is vindictive and so he is a bad bad person. because some of us wrote to his boss, he is now writing bad articles about employer exploitation - making sure that to make it appear us like slumdogs. its just tells us that he is not only a racist jounalist but a bad person.
Its a "she" :-)

Moira Herbst
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  #56 (permalink)  
Old 07-08-2009, 10:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sayantan76 View Post
Its a "she" :-)

Moira Herbst
U sound like a nurse who comes out of the birthing room announcing "It's a she"
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  #57 (permalink)  
Old 07-08-2009, 10:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gc28262 View Post
sayantan76's comments maybe ideologically correct. The author might have written neither supporting/nor opposing anti-immigrants view. However the perception of an article written favoring anti-immigrants/racist in Business Week do hurt our cause.

It is not about whether the "S" word hurt us personally, the issue is "is the article hurting our interests".

Regarding the merits of the article, does copy-pasting somebody else's view without contributing one's own thought process into the article make a journalist ? An anti-immigrant could have written that article themselves. Why does Business Week need a "journalist" like Moira to do that job ?
As I mentioned in my earlier post - the article was indeed one-sided - no question about that......but the way to make future such articles/ reports more balanced (or even leaning in our favor) is not to launch personal attacks on a journalist in good standing (Moira or Lou) or a reputed magazine or even an emotional outpouring of a sense of hurt - but to make the IV organization so relevant in the mainstream debate on the subject that any journalist reporting on the issue will ignore IV at his/ her own peril.......i.e it would have to be obvious to them that if they write an article on EB immigration and do not quote IV - their article will not have credibility.......for example - whenever there is an article on gun control - 9 out of 10 times - NRA is always quoted .........on race issues - ACLU gets quoted very often..........

I think the point of quoting the blogger in the article was just to drive home the point that not all anti-immigrants agree with the academic whose views were the central theme of the article.......we are looking for fire where none exists
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  #58 (permalink)  
Old 07-08-2009, 10:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by walking_dude View Post
Dear Holier-than-thou sayantan who hasn't contributed anything to the community,

I tried to make sense of your comment, which may or may not be there in our comment, which you may or may not have made, considering the fact that IV members may or may not heed your - may or may not be- useful advice. That's entirely their prerogative.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Seriously guys, when we don't need advice from these pseudo-intellectuals who haven't contributed anything [donations and otherwise] to the community, it keeps pouring in.
I have no shame in admitting that i have not contributed monetarily to the organization - because IV does not (and has never) espoused the cause of the EB category i belong to......that does not mean I am not a supporter of the cause of a fair and rational EB policy.

And if we think that launching personal attacks at fellow immigrants whose views we do not agree with and spewing venom at journalists for writing an article without quoting us would help our cause - I am glad I am not making such negative contributions.
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  #59 (permalink)  
Old 07-08-2009, 10:42 AM
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My way of protest against Moira Heist & BW - Stop visting BW.com... Even if I have to visit... Don't read her articles and comment those by giving her more hits and publicity.
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  #60 (permalink)  
Old 07-08-2009, 12:46 PM
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Default my 2 cents

Sites like itgrunt (and BW referring to them) are actually good for our cause - albait in a contrarian way. I think majority of the people in the US are decent by nature who abhore out and out racism - which is what itgrunt stands for (and Ms. Moira Herbst endorsed in her article). Now that BW has removed reference to itgrunt - this article is actually damaging for us.

Why? Out and out racism just takes two brain cells to detect. Itgrunt is in that category. Hence, the more popular it becomes with that tiny minority of racists in this country - the more visceral reaction we would have from the silent but decent majority.

People like Matloff are far more dangerous. So is the new BW article without any reference to itgrunt. I actually went through a paper from Matloff - the one where he discusses how H1Bs help age discrimination. He proved for 80% of the article that age discrimination exists, and then in the last paragraph suddenly mentioned some anecdotal stories and concluded that H1B is the cause. If his PhD papers were of this quality then he would not have been a professor by now. So its not a question of capability and there is definitely something else as a hidden motive for him. But detecting that takes faar more ability than 99.99% of the population in ANY country can master.

So my suggestion would be to leave civilized counterpoints to these dangerous articles - and ignore (if you are being mischievious - then maybe encourage) the itgrunt type of things.
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