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  #16 (permalink)  
Old 08-12-2010, 12:46 PM
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Originally Posted by harivenkat View Post
Just dont get what the senator is intending here ....

Not sure if senator is missing it or dodging it ....
The senator is missing it or dodging it - it clearly means one thing -we are invisible as constituents. We are being taken for a ride only because we do not speak up or go meet our lawmakers. They do not see us as ordinary constituents having the same issues as their other constituents. The whole human -angle is missing.

We have to go meet our lawmakers and explain to them our part of the story/ They need to be told and made aware that we live in their constituencies and our grievances are genuine and need to be addressed.

And although this particular bill does not affect people that are here already.. Beware!! the noose is tightening- the next on the chopping block is EB Immigrants.
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  #17 (permalink)  
Old 08-12-2010, 12:46 PM
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Originally Posted by gc28262 View Post
This will infact increase offshoring.

These companies will pay the extra fees, but will change their onshore/offshore model. Will use less H1/L1 visas , but will increase the headcount of offshore operations.

So the smart senator will force more jobs to be outsourced. These jobs will never comeback once gone. If we look back at the 2000 recession, it caused a major shift in the way US companies looked at outsourcing. Pre-2000 many companies didn't believe that all jobs could be outsourced. 2000 recession forced them to think otherwise.

These kind of bills will cause a re-thinking in corporate america's thought process. They will think of creative ways to outsource. Against this senator's hopes, it will reduce jobs here.
after outsourcing at its peak , then comes tag a fee for every outsourcing byte flowing via internet....
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  #18 (permalink)  
Old 08-12-2010, 12:51 PM
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Originally Posted by gc28262 View Post
This will infact increase offshoring.

These companies will pay the extra fees, but will change their onshore/offshore model. Will use less H1/L1 visas , but will increase the headcount of offshore operations.

So the smart senator will force more jobs to be outsourced. These jobs will never comeback once gone. If we look back at the 2000 recession, it caused a major shift in the way US companies looked at outsourcing. Pre-2000 many companies didn't believe that all jobs could be outsourced. 2000 recession forced them to think otherwise.

These kind of bills will cause a re-thinking in corporate america's thought process. They will think of creative ways to outsource. Against this senator's hopes, it will reduce jobs here.
Not true. Whatever they can outsource, its already gone. There are certain position where the clients demand onsite resource. I am not supporting this bill in anyway, I hate infy as much as I hate this bill. Remember these companies did not leave any stone unturned, milked the client every possible way and expoilted the employees to the maximum extent. In one another post - VLDRao was saying these companies does the tax filing on behalf the emoloyee, get the refund and again claim that tax in india using double taxation aoivdance treaty.

Last edited by snathan; 08-12-2010 at 01:08 PM.
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  #19 (permalink)  
Old 08-12-2010, 01:02 PM
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He is slamming consultancy businesses. all together, clearly!
America will pay through the nose for this move.

+2K. Are they crazy?
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  #20 (permalink)  
Old 08-12-2010, 01:05 PM
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Also, how clearly he says, its for Money, and nothing else!
So we are easy target to mint money and we tolerate everything. wow!
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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 08-12-2010, 01:11 PM
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Originally Posted by snathan View Post
Not true. Whatever they can outsource, its already gone. There are certain position where the clients demand onsite resource. I am not supporting this bill in anyway, I hate infy as much as I hate this bill.
I agree to gc28262. Back in 90s when outsourcing started, major Indian IT companies used to have a 50-50 onsite/offshoe component (for large clients/projects). This has now come down to 10-90 onsite/offshore because clients are getting the same level of service.
For example, it was once believed that DBAs must be located at client site. Now, we often see DBA support provided from India.

This causes too much load on the onsite person but who cares as long as there is a steady supply. The bill will simply change the model to 5-95 . Out of these 5 positions cut-down , 4 might be H1 but at least 1 is a citizen/LPR whose job will be eliminated. Along with that will go the number of services these 4 H1s were using in US and the amount they were contributing to US economy.

USCs who think this bill will create more jobs for Americans are living in a fools world.
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  #22 (permalink)  
Old 08-12-2010, 01:13 PM
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H1B-GC has a brilliant future H1B-GC has a brilliant future H1B-GC has a brilliant future H1B-GC has a brilliant future H1B-GC has a brilliant future H1B-GC has a brilliant future H1B-GC has a brilliant future H1B-GC has a brilliant future H1B-GC has a brilliant future H1B-GC has a brilliant future H1B-GC has a brilliant future
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Originally Posted by vbkris77 View Post
So much for unions to support them for mid term elections.. Come next year, if dems still have same majority, H1B/L1B word will be removed from India's IT dictionary..

So much for Hisp@n*c lobby. How does this fee increase relate to border security??? These politicians have to remember that whatever money they are getting for Social/Medicare taxes from L1/h1 till now will be gone as well along with the job.
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Last edited by H1B-GC; 08-12-2010 at 01:42 PM.
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  #23 (permalink)  
Old 08-12-2010, 01:15 PM
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Originally Posted by snathan View Post
and expoilted the employees to the maximum extent. In one another post - VLDRao was saying these companies does the tax filing on behalf the emoloyee, get the refund and again claim that tax in india using double taxation aoivdance treaty.
True. But why then does an employee want to join such company ? It is not that you are not aware of all these before you step to this country through Infy or TCS ?
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  #24 (permalink)  
Old 08-12-2010, 01:17 PM
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Originally Posted by krishmunn View Post
True. But why then does an employee want to join such company ? It is not that you are not aware of all these before you step to this country through Infy or TCS ?
I never worked for them. But I have seen so many people suffering and they are ready to suffer to be in the US. I dont want to deviate from the thread..so lets stop this discussion about INFY.

Last edited by snathan; 08-12-2010 at 01:21 PM.
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  #25 (permalink)  
Old 08-12-2010, 01:20 PM
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Originally Posted by krishmunn View Post
I agree to gc28262. Back in 90s when outsourcing started, major Indian IT companies used to have a 50-50 onsite/offshoe component (for large clients/projects). This has now come down to 10-90 onsite/offshore because clients are getting the same level of service.
For example, it was once believed that DBAs must be located at client site. Now, we often see DBA support provided from India.

This causes too much load on the onsite person but who cares as long as there is a steady supply. The bill will simply change the model to 5-95 . Out of these 5 positions cut-down , 4 might be H1 but at least 1 is a citizen/LPR whose job will be eliminated. Along with that will go the number of services these 4 H1s were using in US and the amount they were contributing to US economy.

USCs who think this bill will create more jobs for Americans are living in a fools world.
I second this...they are thinking even the global warming is because of immigrants - H1B
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  #26 (permalink)  
Old 08-12-2010, 01:29 PM
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Originally Posted by amitjoey View Post
The senator is missing it or dodging it - it clearly means one thing -we are invisible as constituents. We are being taken for a ride only because we do not speak up or go meet our lawmakers. They do not see us as ordinary constituents having the same issues as their other constituents. The whole human -angle is missing.

We have to go meet our lawmakers and explain to them our part of the story/ They need to be told and made aware that we live in their constituencies and our grievances are genuine and need to be addressed.

And although this particular bill does not affect people that are here already.. Beware!! the noose is tightening- the next on the chopping block is EB Immigrants.
To answer your question: Indian companies in India or Indian politicians complaining will not do much impact. After passing this bill politicians will cosy up and say good things to rebuild relations. The real impact can happen if Indians in New York state who can vote stand up against such laws. Same goes for the Desi companies who have tried to raise the voice against USCIS memo. They lack grassroots advocacy and support. Their Indian US citizen friends are busy organizing Diwali melas and Shahrukh Khan stage shows. Immigration voice can be extremely successful if politicians see us as an immigrant lobby. Just like they see Jewish lobby or Hispanic lobby. This is why participation of IV greencard members and citizen friends is important to advocate for changes that helps the immigrant community. I this case too, IV community should not turn a blind eye to what happens around us. Just because we do not work for such companies or we already have EAD does not mean we do not see beyond the headline of this issue. We spend more time analyzing , over analyzing, predicting and tracking rather than actively understanding the politics of issues that are causing all the problems we are facing. To some extent this law passed because Indians in USA did not care due to their narrow outlook and priorities in politics.
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Last edited by pappu; 08-12-2010 at 01:43 PM.
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  #27 (permalink)  
Old 08-12-2010, 01:32 PM
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Originally Posted by pappu View Post
They could have done this and re-captured visas with additional fees or whatever. And called it greencard fraud fees it that makes them happy. But the fact is they did not want to do anything to give relief to Immigrants. Recapture (hundreds of thousands of visas) would have significantly helped helped retrogressed countries like EB3 India, China, ROW and EB2 India China. They can take additional fees as long as we know the recapture is being done.
Just looking at the employment based inventory statistics, if every applicant were charged $2000 for visa recapture, it is close to $400M for uncle sam. All EB backlogs would be eliminated, new immigrants would continue contributing to Social security, pay taxes, buy new homes, invest etc... Cant they see the potential upside to this?
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old 08-12-2010, 01:32 PM
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Originally Posted by anandrajesh View Post
All they had to do was to introduce another $2000 fee for every Green Card Re-Captured. Most of us would have been out of this mess and they would have got the money they needed. This Grand posturing is extremely disturbing and i hate the politics behind it.
I wish the Democrats lose big time and lose their hold from Senate and house.

we all seem to think that after our problem is fixed, all the problems in the world will be gone..... if there is hunger problem, our solution ought to be increase in eb quota..... if there is drinking water problem, our solution is recapture.....

my reading is that chinese & indians think too much of themselves.... as if the world would collapse without them..... very narrow thinking..... now u would see a few here blaming indian politicians, some saying outsourcing will increase, some saying US will lose more jobs, world will fall apart...... well that's just too much reality for one day

lets get back to the important subjects of eb3 & eb2, crapy data analysis, shitty predictions & lets find out who is better than everyone else, is eb2 better more deserving that eb3....... or will the world stop spinning if the dates do not progress in the next month visa bulletin....... & those self-importance professing indian press articles..... these r the discussions we should be having.... can we please get back to those more important topics.....
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  #29 (permalink)  
Old 08-12-2010, 01:36 PM
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Default That was only done by TCS

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Originally Posted by snathan View Post
Not true. Whatever they can outsource, its already gone. There are certain position where the clients demand onsite resource. I am not supporting this bill in anyway, I hate infy as much as I hate this bill. Remember these companies did not leave any stone unturned, milked the client every possible way and expoilted the employees to the maximum extent. In one another post - VLDRao was saying these companies does the tax filing on behalf the emoloyee, get the refund and again claim that tax in india using double taxation aoivdance treaty.
This was a practice only done by TCS a few years ago. And even that has stopped now (albeit because of a lawsuit filed by some employees)
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  #30 (permalink)  
Old 08-12-2010, 01:37 PM
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Originally Posted by SDdesi View Post
Just looking at the employment based inventory statistics, if every applicant were charged $2000 for visa recapture, it is close to $400M for uncle sam. All EB backlogs would be eliminated, new immigrants would continue contributing to Social security, pay taxes, buy new homes, invest etc... Cant they see the potential upside to this?
here comes another one..... keep it coming....

we are just too far off from the reality..... arent' we
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