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-   -   Social security benefits and H1B with 40 credits (https://immigrationvoice.org/forum/forum99-tax-social-security-and-financial-issues-for-immigrants-and-nonimmigrants/3096781-social-security-benefits-and-h1b-with-40-credits.html)

krish2005 04-12-2016 10:25 PM

Social security benefits and H1B with 40 credits
 
Sad news guys!! Maybe many of you might have already known.

Since there is no international agreement between India and US. One (Indian Citizen) cannot benefit even with 40+ social security credits and returning back to India.

I spoke to a representative today at SSN at length. She checked many documents before confirming that information. Unless there is an agreement in the future, all these are going in waste for now...

But please correct me if you do have any good information on the above.

I am such a situation. Being on H1B with approved I140, employment at a limbo and 40+ credits all at no use. Unless something happens in a few days, its going to be critical in my case.

All the best for the rest of you folks.

Krishna

4WatItsWorth 04-13-2016 09:14 AM

That's not correct. If the worker lived in the US for 10 years or had 40 credits, they can get benefits payments sent to them outside US. Read this - https://www.ssa.gov/pubs/EN-05-10137.pdf. India is listed as a country on page 9 whose citizens are eligible for SS benefits. Dependents and survivors have additional requirements to meet.

Flyingcrow 04-13-2016 10:00 AM

This is what it says, "If you are a U.S. citizen, you may receive your Social Security payments outside the United States as long as you are eligible. "

Keyword - "Citizen".

Happygolucky1 04-13-2016 10:44 AM

India is listed on Page 9 whose citizens are eligible.
 
Brothers, we need to read in conjunction the last part of page 8, page 9 and initial part of page 10.
I believe Indian citizens are eligible to receive SSA benefits after 40 credits.
Experts or who know people receiving these SSA benefits currently back in India please comment.

dipdowndust 04-13-2016 12:49 PM

Read this on page 5. SSA will only make payments if you are NOT a US citizen and you are citizen of following listed countries and India is not one of them. They re-iterate this again on page 8 that following countries have agreement with USA.

It also states that if you are receiving SSA payout and if you step out of the country for more then 6 months and you are not a US citizen then they will stop payment. Like others have stated, you can get payment in India but only if you are a US citizen.

Details on Page 9 is only if your dependent or survivor lived in Belgium, Germany, Sweden and Switzerland AND the person who earned the credit was citizen of the listed countries, which includes INDIA then only you get payments. But, this has to be very very rare case.

Thanks for putting light on this, I never really thought about this and I always assumed that once you pay Social security and even if you move to India you may get benefits. But not anymore !

===============
However, our agreements with Austria, Belgium, Germany, Sweden and Switzerland allow you to get benefits as a dependent or survivor of a worker while residing in the foreign
country. This is true only if:
•
The worker is (or was at the time of death) a U.S. citizen or a citizen of your country of residence; or
•
You are a citizen of one of the countries listed on page 9 , and the worker on whose record your benefits are based lived in the United States for at least 10 years
or earned at least 40 credits under
================

=====================
If you are a citizen of one of the countries listed below, we will continue your U.S. Social Security payments as long as you are eligible, no matter how long you stay outside the United States:
•
Austria
•
Belgium
•
Canada
•
Chile
•
Czech Republic
•
Finland
•
France
•
Germany
•
Greece
•
Ireland
•
Israel
•
Italy
•
Japan
•
Korea (South)
•
Luxembourg
•
Netherlands
•
Norway
•
Poland
•
Portugal
•
Spain
•
Sweden
•
Switzerland
•
United Kingdom

4WatItsWorth 04-13-2016 01:49 PM

You need to also read the exception to that rule on page 8 and 9.

longwait4gc 04-13-2016 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4WatItsWorth (Post 3596267)
You need to also read the exception to that rule on page 8 and 9.

I think we are eligible:
You are a citizen of one of the
countries listed on page 9, and
the worker on whose record your
benefits are based lived in the
United States for at least 10 years
or earned at least 40 credits under
9
the U.S. Social Security system.
If you are getting benefits as a
dependent or survivor, see pages
10 and 11 for more requirements
********
final exception:
If you are not a U.S. citizen and
none of these exceptions applies to
you, we will stop your payments
after you have been outside the
United States for six full months.

*******
One of these exceptions apply to us so we are fine.

Happygolucky1 04-13-2016 07:47 PM

dipdowndust is right.
 
Seems dipdowndust is right. Unless you are US citizen; Indians are NOT eligible. Thanks a ton for brainstorming this. It would definitely help all to plan the things in long term. :mad:

krish2005 04-13-2016 07:57 PM

Some positive is still possible!
 
Given that there is still some discussions between india and US for many years now. They will be meeting for 10th time in 2016 year

India, US to keep talking about visa, double taxation issues | India & World Latest News at NewsX

Or maybe it will just be another year passing by without resolution too..

dipdowndust 04-14-2016 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by longwait4gc (Post 3596270)
I think we are eligible:
You are a citizen of one of the
countries listed on page 9, and
the worker on whose record your
benefits are based lived in the
United States for at least 10 years
or earned at least 40 credits under
9
the U.S. Social Security system.
If you are getting benefits as a
dependent or survivor, see pages
10 and 11 for more requirements
********
final exception:
If you are not a U.S. citizen and
none of these exceptions applies to
you, we will stop your payments
after you have been outside the
United States for six full months.

*******
One of these exceptions apply to us so we are fine.

If you worked here for 10 yrs and decided to move back to India without being a US citizen then you will NOT get your Social security payments if you are in India, so the SSN tax you paid is down the drain. Soon this will be true for many people e.g. EB3 folks filed in 2012-2016, they are slated to get their GC in 30-40 years. So, lets say they work here for 10 yrs and then give up the fight and just go back to India. Once they retire, they will not get SS pay.

The only exception I spotted in which you can get PAID is if the person who has earned credit dies and their dependents lives in below listed countries. In this one INDIA is listed but there is a very slim chance that dependents will move to Belgium to collect SS payments.
==============
However, our agreements with Austria, Belgium, Germany, Sweden and Switzerland allow you to get benefits as a dependent or survivor of a worker while residing in the foreign
country. This is true only if:
•
The worker is (or was at the time of death) a U.S. citizen or a citizen of your country of residence; or
•
You are a citizen of one of the countries listed on page 9 , and the worker on whose record your benefits are based lived in the United States for at least 10 years
or earned at least 40 credits under

I140Qn 10-10-2016 04:40 PM

Question, seems legit
 
It says clearly at :

https://www.ssa.gov/pubs/EN-05-10137.pdf and India is listed, how come nobody has been able to claim, is it because it triggers only after 62 years of age?.

5. If you are a citizen of one of the
countries listed in the chart below,
we will continue to pay your
benefits outside the United States if:
a) You are receiving benefits based
on your own earnings, and you
earned at least 40 credits under
the U.S. Social Security system
or lived at least 10 years in the
United States; or
b) You are receiving benefits as
dependent or survivor of a worker
who earned at least 40 credits
under the U.S. Social Security
system or lived in the United States
for at least 10 years. You must
also meet the conditions under
the heading “Additional residency
requirements for dependents and
survivors” in this publication.

VVNMURTY 12-14-2016 08:22 PM

Hi,
I am 60 years old and going to retire exactly in 2 years at 62 completion.

I already have 40+ credits

I personally spoke to the social security office today, 14th December 2016 at 5:45 PM and they verified the international agreement with India and the PDF for the "payments when you are abroad" book revised version printed in April 2016 which has the point 5(a) mentioned by member I149 QN above which is 100% true.

Social security confirmed that, since you are receiving benefits "on your own behalf" and has 40+ credits, and staying in India, the current-international-agreement permits the payments to India. So they told me to apply the formal documents for the benefits about 6 months before the retirement,

I am sure this information would be useful to a lot of people who are in similar condition like me. If any further details are required I can clarify. (Normally I don't need to be open this much, since I got what I wanted, but having faced the trauma of more than 2 years searching various websites on this issue, with various conflicting statements in this issue, thought this would help others not to face the same trauma. The latest version of the social security payments while abroad printed in April 2016 is the key here. I have both the PDFs the version before March 2016 and after April 2016 saved to compare the exact differences).

bejotravels 12-15-2016 03:11 AM

Indian Travel Agents In USA
Best Tourist Places in Pakistan - :)

Happygolucky1 04-24-2017 03:15 PM

Dear VVNMurty Sir,
I deeply and sincerely appreciate your reply in this regard and enlightening me with your personal experience. You have ignited a new hope in my life. Can you please clarify if you are still INDIAN citizen and spoke to SS office in the context of continuing to be Indian citizen when you would be applying for SS benefits attaining your age 62. I'm sorry being bit too specific but I'm also on the verge of taking my life's biggest decision based on this.
As you said revised PDF is the key; they have new language and clauses added on page 7. Thanks a ton in advance for your prompt response.

Happygolucky1 04-24-2017 04:01 PM

Pls clarify
 
Dear VVNMurty Sir,
I deeply and sincerely appreciate your reply in this regard and enlightening me with your personal experience. You have ignited a new hope in my life. Can you please clarify if you are still INDIAN citizen and spoke to SS office in the context of continuing to be Indian citizen when you would be applying for SS benefits attaining your age 62. I'm sorry being bit too specific but I'm also on the verge of taking my life's biggest decision based on this.
As you said revised PDF is the key; they have new language and clauses added on page 7. Thanks a ton in advance for your prompt response.


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